tolex is not my friend

[Andy Le Blanc]

anybody have a good hard copy referrence out there about amp covering?
ive got a library on valves but nothing on that....
there must be a technical treaties on suitcase manufacture or something....

[Structo]

Andy I have sort of a tutorial that Jim Seavall did.
This is with Tweed but it should apply to any tolex.
I think I copied if off the web and saved it in MS Word.
If you want a copy PM me your email addy.
Tom

[Ron Worley]

Andy- here's what I have, but I will tell you that I use the tolex glue from Antique Electronics... it is so easy to work with, and cleans up very well.

Ron

[nickt]

Andy - tolex may not be your friend but those chrome fender style amp corners certainly are! They cover a multitude of tolexing sins.

Otherwise: the stinky-and-gives-you-cancer type contact adhesive is best. The water based stuff just doesn't work (well not for me anyway).

Good luck.

[Andy Le Blanc]

thank you... every bit helps
The last cab came out ok.... but its an effort
ive also found those chrome corners aren't just there to
protect the corner..... and although its not the worst stuff.....
I didnt need a respirator..... the stinky glue comes with a warning to
turn of all your gas pilots.... its consistancy that im after.....
I do all the fab work, metal, wood, assembly, dressing, and tolex is the next
thing to consentrate on.... and worse......
my wifes father was an uphosterer... she loves the covered presentation
I like a wooden presentation.... but the trend (tradition) is heavily toward
tolex

[muchxs]

anybody have a good hard copy referrence out there about amp covering?
ive got a library on valves but nothing on that....
there must be a technical treaties on suitcase manufacture or something....

Being as we're just about neighbors you should really order a cab or two from me. Then copy what you see, after a year or two of practice you'll start to see results!

I thought about offering a tutorial but what the hell, I had to learn this the hard way.

[billyz]

When I first started recovering amps many years ago, I was told to use contact cement. I found out the hard way that I did not like the results.
Fortunately, in my search for the answer, I was put in contact with Sam Hutton. He told me to use Hide Glue. You need a hot pot, the stuff works like a dream. And it is what the manufacturers used, only with a big applicator machine. for small repairs I use regular white glue and a little masking tape until it dries.

I have seen too many contact cement jobs come loose over time around the edges and especially the back where the heat from the tubes makes it let go.

I have not tried the new tolex glue, it is expensive compared to hide glue since I already have the pot. Oh, And don't use the liquid hide glue either. I tried it , no good.

A sharp razor blade/knife, straight edge ,ruler and staple gun is all you need. And of course a good prep job to the bare cabinet.

[Lonely Raven]

I have to say, Muchxs' cabs are really, really well done.

I've done probably a half dozen cabs myself, and I know it's a pain. I've seen good work and bad work, but I've never seen work as tight as Eric's (muchxs).

Seriously, it's an example to follow!

That said, I too have been told by the old timers that it's hide glue that you need. I found that out after many frustrating times trying out various glues to repair and the half dozen or so that I built from scratch. I've not tried the hide glue, but that's certainly the old skool way. My best so far as been with the 3M Spray on glue. I forgot the exact name and it's all packed up for my move...but I used the 90 strength. You can pick it up at the big box stores.

[drhulsey]

Good info here:
http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff24 ... 20Cabinet/

[muchxs]

I've never seen work as tight as Eric's (muchxs).

That said, I too have been told by the old timers that it's hide glue that you need.

I use contact cement. Hide glue is o.k. but my process requires that the tolex stick where I want it on the first try. Hide glue is temperature dependent, when it's hot it doesn't stick and when it's cool it does. If the cabinet is exposed to moisture or humidity the hide glue lets loose again.

If you want to see a really good covering job check out a Reeves. He's the HiWatt guy although he no longer owns the rights to the HiWatt name. It's the best covering job out there, it makes me look like an amateur.

[Lonely Raven]

Good info here:
http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff24 ... 20Cabinet/

That's the same guide I learned from.

Eric, I'm floored that someone would make you look like a beginner. I have to see what this guy does!

[Andy Le Blanc]

I do value experience...... now hide glue.....
do you really mean the kind bought in pellets, melted with a little water
in a double boiler..... Ive used that for instruments...... glueing compo for frame restoration and guilding....
that kind of hide glue....
I did like the way the contact cement holds it together
wouldnt mind trying the hide glue.... I assume its the same double glue techniqe and the contact cement....
Ive another one in a week.... I was thinking of using some piping
to cover seems...... one of the mistakes I ve made repeatedly is to construct the cab without fully considering
the requirements of all the steps to a finished project...... its a bad habit to try and compensate for
something that youve discoverd two thirds of the way along.....
ive noticed too that the fender cabs have a relativly flat front where the most seen tolex seems are...
where they dont use a metal corner...
thanks again for the pointers.....
hopfully I be getting a camera going to share more.....

[muchxs]

Here are a couple tips:

In general there are two different types of corners, let's call them "tweed" and "miter". If you look at Fender amps they used the same corner on the tweed amps and the tolex covered amps, it's not a 45 degree cut. That's the "tweed" corner. In the '50s that cut was necessary to line up the weave in the tweed. I expect Fender continued to use the same covering pattern on the tolex amps because that's what Fender's workers were used to.

A 45 degree mitered cut in the covering is quicker and easier.

Dan at TubeGarden cut his corners with scissors and mashed them together, that became the accepted procedure. Tubegarden got glowing Harmony Central reviews prior to an event we'll call "The TubeGarden Fiasco". I've re-covered some TubeGarden cabinets and IMHO they're not worthy of glowing praise, it turns out the covering methods weren't durable.

I use a Stanley retractable utility knife with a fresh blade for each covering job. A sharp blade is essential to accurate work, the retractable knife is OSHA approved. I've worked with an old Stanley 99 with a fixed blade and I'm fortunate not to have required a trip to the hospital. I've become pretty cavalier with the blade so retracting it when it's not in use is a good habit to adopt.

Don't stretch the covering.

The cabinet will be covered so you can make reference marks on it, you won't see them once it's covered.

[Andy Le Blanc]

under stand the need for an untrasharp blade...... had an issue with ragged
cuts.... the miter worked but did have a "precision" issue... and Ive
seen the no stretch many places...... hard not to do..... its very easy to
try force

[billyz]

Actually the hide glue that I use is from Stewart McDonald, comes in a can, dry pellets or flakes. Mix with hot water. The originals were applied to the Tolex only I believe. I use a heavy small roller too. However I don't believe it needs to applied to both surfaces like contact cement. Does give you a few minutes to work it, which I find nice in the corners where I double cut with a new razor blade. I use a small single edge blade for the corner cuts. Cleans up up nice with a warm damp rag.

But then I started doing recovers , so I wanted it to be as accurate as possible. If I get the right tolex almost no one could tell it was a recover.

I even used dark staples to replicate the originals.

But I am old school. Maybe I never found the right contact cement.