NOS John Mayer Sig / Wonderland 100W

[dbharris]

Here is I believe a few JM Custom''s If anyone cares
JMCustomInnen.jpgJohnMayerCustomInnen.jpg
Tony

Thanks Tony! I had one of those, but not the other.

-Dan

[talbany]

Here is I believe a few JM Custom''s If anyone cares
JMCustomInnen.jpgJohnMayerCustomInnen.jpg
Tony

Thanks Tony! I had one of those, but not the other.

-Dan

Here is a few other things I have about the JM Model.Don't know if it helps or if you already have it as I am not really a 2 Rock guy but better late than never. (Schematic by Aaron)

John Mayer Schematic.jpg

Here is an amp that actually went to John (notice the measurements of all the caps) and the choice of Metal film caps (NTE's) over the Carbons in the others.This was no doubt a voicing john preferred. It would be nice to see the rest of this amp to get John's complete preferred parts list..IMO I'ts not a completely accurate JM sig Model without the exact parts. John's having certain parts and the ones going to the general public be another.
I will keep digging.

MayerTag.jpg

[dbharris]

Good stuff Tony!

I have a picture of that same amp, wider field but much lower resolution:

TwoRockCustomforJM.jpg

I also have this schematic, that I think matches Taylor's layout more closely:

Two Rock John Mayer Production Schematic.jpg

Pardon my ignorance, but are those NTEs still readily available on Ebay in the right values or are they unobtanium now?

I did order some modern metal films in line with that Ryan's modified layout noted. But I think one is actually metal oxide that Mouser has mis-categorized? Can't remember the brand off hand, maybe Yageo?

I have not built enough amps to know if my ears can detect differences between parts types. But if the parts are available (even if difficult to find or expensive), it makes sense to me to try and be as accurate as possible. I'm building one amp of each circuit just for my own use, not production. And if true, the amp sounds better (more close to an original) but if false, I have lost nothing but time and some coin. The chase is part of the fun! I tend to believe that parts type effects the sound and that even if an "average" set of ears can't detect say a swap in the slope resistor type, that it may still impact the overall timbre of the amp enough when playing that listeners find it sounds more pleasing.

JM has a long history of his production signature gear not being exactly what his personal signature gear is. Almost certain that the amps Two Rock made for him have different parts types as well as some values. Not to mention the fact Two Rock created "true" prototypes for JM before and after the run of 25 amps. Confounded by the fact that Two Rock also sold "prototypes" to the public following the run of 25 because demand was so high. My understanding is that these were not actual prototypes but extra chassis JM had signed in case some were damaged in shipping. They later sold some unmarked JM amps to continue with demands from good customers. Then the Crystal was released...and so on.

-Dan

[brewdude]

Why is there a small square pixelated obscuring the view?
Is there incriminating markings?

[talbany]

I would say that I have over 150 shots of the various Two Rock model's and if there is one thing they took from H.A.D early on was his parts (and a few other things). They even took his formica boards and coax.So it would seem that they figured out along the way that there was something to H.A.D's parts selection which IMO is why Two Rocks command such high prices. They paid attention to the details and stayed with it never went to mass produced PCB style and built a well respected amp by many of the top players. (I've played several Killer sounding ones )
They could have very easily gone to a PCB based amp but didn't because they know it would alter the sound of what they were going for (Dumble Sound).Having run an Amp manufacturing company for 8 years who did try to go PCB eventually went back to hand cut eyelet boards (including power supply),it definitely altered the sound of our ODS style amps and to this day can still spot a PCB ODS a mile away. Enough with PCB's

So yes the NTE's were taken from H.A.D along with the dralorics and have even seen a few Q-lines loaded and were the first to use the brown RN Dales.(No Black Sprague bypass caps )
They pop up on E-Bay occasionally.There were 2 different types HAD used, the earlier ones (That's in 183) and the later WH's 2 Rock used, as these were readily available until recently.
(let me know if you find some )
Yep! It is not at all uncommon for amp manufacturers to go that extra mile with their high profile clients everyone does it.When they go to pitch them their amps they want to give them their best sounding ones.Even if they build 2 exactly alike with the same parts they will save the better of the 2 or keep a good sounding one off the line held back and save it for just these people. Everyone does it and don't let them tell you any different

Parts selection IMO also depends on the type of amp.The Wonderland being a mostly clean style amp somewhat limited in voicings is IMO is not quite as finicky as a more versatile amp like the ODS where you have a clean side cascading overdrive and a boost side which requires a bit more of a balance. Transparency,clarity and texture is a bit more critical.

There are basically 2 different routes you can go parts wise? You can either try several that look good or have been recommended.
Another way is? If you run across an amp that sounds really good to you find out what parts were used and start trying them in your builds is another way there or keep searching until you eventually find the ones H.A.D used.
(At some point I should do a breakdown on my interpretation of How these different resistors react if it helps )

Your build looks Great and Thanks for the shot and schematic!
Tony

[talbany]

Why is there a small square pixelated obscuring the view?
Is there incriminating markings?

I Think it says "Election Fraud" there


Tony

[mojotom]

Parts selection IMO also depends on the type of amp.The Wonderland being a mostly clean style amp somewhat limited in voicings is IMO is not quite as finicky as a more versatile amp like the ODS where you have a clean side cascading overdrive and a boost side which requires a bit more of a balance. Transparency,clarity and texture is a bit more critical.

Your build looks Great and Thanks for the shot and schematic!
Tony

On mine I didn’t notice that much of an effect when I upgraded the parts last year (especially resistors). It was really noticeable on the ODS.
I would say the JM is quite tolerant regarding choice of parts. I was a bit underwhelmed when the changes were done (last year to the day) as I upgraded my ODS first and though it would change as much.
Not saying it doesn’t change a thing but can be build using good quality parts and still sound JM.

[talbany]

On mine I didn’t notice that much of an effect when I upgraded the parts last year (especially resistors). It was really noticeable on the ODS.

I too noticed something similar when I updated my SSS about 3 years ago with a resistor makeover and although there was a slight change it was nowhere near as prevalent as when I did my ODS's. This is why I always stipulate it depends on the amp! I have not yet built a Wonderland so it's good to get as many documented opinions on their experiences with reguards to different parts types as much as possible. However,? I would imagine going from an amp with all carbon films over to one with all metal films would be a rather noticeable shift regardless of the design of the amp? Do you also have an opinion on this when you did your upgrade? or did you just go from C.F to C.F?

Thanks!
Tony

[mojotom]

I was using PRP MF for plates and Koa CF for everything else and I kept the same composition type when I upgraded the amp.

[rccolgan]

I think NTE is still available? https://www.cablesandconnectors.com/120001.HTM

I also bought koa Speer metal film that look strikingly similar

[talbany]

I think NTE is still available? https://www.cablesandconnectors.com/120001.HTM

I also bought koa Speer metal film that look strikingly similar

Thanks for posting. Have you ordered any of these NTE metal film resistors yet?

Tony

[dbharris]

I think NTE is still available? https://www.cablesandconnectors.com/120001.HTM

I also bought koa Speer metal film that look strikingly similar

Thanks for posting. Have you ordered any of these NTE metal film resistors yet?

Tony

Thanks for the link Ryan. I would be willing to take a gamble and order a few resistors as a test.

Tony, by the way that Two Rock gut shot you posted is a Custom Reverb Signature, right? See manual here https://www.two-rock.com/ownermanuals/c ... manual.pdf More or less an ODR with half a d'lator I think. Looks like RG59 too for the coax.

"V1-12AX7, Rhythm channel
V2-12AX7, Lead Channel
V3-5751/12AT7, Reverb Driver
V4-12AX7, Reverb/effects
V5-12AX7. Phase Inverter
V6, V7-6L6GC, Output
V8, V9-6L6GC, Output (100 Watt)
V8, V9-5AR4 (50 Watt Tube Rectified)"

-Dan

[talbany]

Dan
Yes I know you can clearly see the OD entrance trimmer on top.
I also just posted a schematic here
https://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... 82#p425382

Tony

[dbharris]

Yeah I realize you posted it bc that amp was custom made for Mayer. Thanks for the link to the schematic!

-Dan

[norburybrook]

was there ever a clear decision about the 1M -68k voltage divider? as there seem to be more pictures than were available when I built mine i wonder if there's a clearer shot of that 'node'. At the time I spoke to jelle and he said that the values of this node posted on Taylors layout didn't make a lot of sense as it cut so much gain, making the master volume unnecessary.


I good friend of mine played one of the 25 JM original amps his friend owned, he'd paid £25,000 that's about $35,000 for it. When he AB against my JM/SSS he preferred mine ironically mine is slightly different with 510vDC on the plates and higher pre amp voltages like the SSS and a different voltage divider for a little more gain. Maybe that made the difference he preferred.






M