one-stop shop for refurbing an old amp?

[Analog Assassin]

I need to fix this old brown fender princeton. It works, but it needs new pots, jacks, a speaker, in addition the tolex and grill cloth were spray painted black, so I need to change that, oh, and a handle and knobs. That's about it. Oh, and some tubes.
Any one good place to order all these things from? I got this amp for nearly nothing, and I'm going to fix 'er up and probably sell it.

[Structo]

Try here:
http://www.hoffmanamps.com/

[CaseyJones]

I need to fix this old brown fender princeton... I'm going to fix 'er up and probably sell it.

If you're going to sell it anyway don't touch it. I don't think there's going to be a big difference in selling price between ratty original condition and "restored" condition. If it were mine I'd clean the original pots, track down the correct speaker, replace the minimum amount of parts that really needed to be replaced and maybe even save the original tolex. Cheap spray paint comes off pretty easily. I have a favorite solvent that will loosen the paint and not harm the tolex.

[Structo]

And pray tell, what is this mystery solvent?

[CaseyJones]

And pray tell, what is this mystery solvent?

Charcoal lighter fluid. Any light hydrocarbon based solvent will do, mineral oil works, subturps works. I like the charcoal lighter because it's not too agressive and it evaporates clean.

[Structo]

Naphtha?

[Phil_S]

Do the minimum to get it in good working order. Try to find authentic parts. Be careful to make the work look "right". The more you do to it, the more likely you are to lower the value, unless, of course, you have a great deal of experience with old amp restoration. Don't fool with the tolex at all.

[rfgordon]

If you don't want to use solvents, get a roll of Gorilla tape and pretend you're waxing a supermodel. Rub the tape into the tolex grain really good, and peel away.

Because the plasticizers (chemicals that keep plastic stuff like vinyl pliable) constantly migrate to the surface, paint doesn't tend to adhere to vinyl, so the chemistry is in your favor.

[Analog Assassin]

guys,
The tolex is beyond help. I've tried cleaning it, but that rough brown tolex from that era is impossible to clean. The deep crevices hold the paint and it feels like he sprayed it with primer. It just won't come loose.
The speaker that came with it had no cone. Someone tracked the numbers back to Quam. I'm not sure that Fender ever used Quam speakers, so I don't think it's original.
The pots were frozen. The amp handle is missing.
It does work though, but there's a bad hum. So I'm pretty sure the filter caps need changing.
I think overall the value would be better refurb'ed than what it is right now.

[doctord02]

You may be suprised at how good it sounds when fixed up. My brown Princeton is the single amp out of my collection that will never get sold... It also got recovered in Black and has a Celestion 10" installed as well, so it's buggered as far as collectability goes anyhow.

BTW, a Celestion G10M-50 sounds *killer* in one of these. Plug a Les Paul in and set the volume on 7 and the tone on 5 and you instantly sound like Billy Gibbons on Tres Hombres.

[CaseyJones]

The tolex is beyond help. I've tried cleaning it, but that rough brown tolex from that era is impossible to clean. The deep crevices hold the paint and it feels like he sprayed it with primer. It just won't come loose.

Yeah, that rough brown can be hard to clean even if it's just dusty. I'd still try to find the right solvent to loosen up the paint, maybe even use aircraft stripper. If you're thinking of re-covering it anyway what do you have to lose?

The pots were frozen.

The pots freeze at the bushings. Hit the shaft with a squirt of PB Blast then use Deoxit to clean the pots once they move.

The amp handle is missing.

O.k., so replace it.

It does work though, but there's a bad hum. So I'm pretty sure the filter caps need changing.
I think overall the value would be better refurb'ed than what it is right now.

Filter caps are generally a good idea for an amp that old. It sounds like it's been damp or wet, moisture can be hell on an amp.

I'd still do the absolute minimum to the hardware and the cabinet. If it was mine I'd dump it into a repro cabinet and save the original cab as-is. Tag, bag and save anything you replace.

[Analog Assassin]

The tolex seems to be in good shape, other than the spray paint. If I can clean it off, I will. Believe me, I don't feel like ordering covering at 17 bucks a yard and recovering it. It just doesn't look fun.

When I got the amp, ebay prices were $400. Now I saw someone selling just the amp chassis for 500, there was a clean amp with a Weber speaker for $1000. I think I'll fix her up and hold onto her for a while. I mean hell, they're Fenders. You know it's going to sound great.

[Analog Assassin]

Okay, I tried charcoal lighter fluid. The spray paint just laughed at that. I need to bring out the strong stuff now. What should I use? Naturally, I'll try it on an inconspicuous spot first.

The grill cloth is also painted. I think I might order new grill cloth and try aging it a bit. What's your take on that?

[CaseyJones]

The tolex seems to be in good shape, other than the spray paint. If I can clean it off, I will. Believe me, I don't feel like ordering covering at 17 bucks a yard and recovering it. It just doesn't look fun.

It's more like $15.00 per yard plus $7.00 s & h. If you got your grille at the same time it takes the sting outta shipping.

A re-cover job isn't all that bad... if you've done it before. The nice thing about rough brown is that the repro material is very close to the original, durable cotton backing, the wheat grille is pretty good, too. Same with the wheat grille, it's nice.

The current issue blackface grille isn't even close. It's really thin crappy material. The original grille feels thick and greasy no matter what era we're talking about. Like I said brown is good, the material is convincing.

When I got the amp, ebay prices were $400. Now I saw someone selling just the amp chassis for $500, there was a clean amp with a Weber speaker for $1000. I think I'll fix her up and hold onto her for a while. I mean hell, they're Fenders. You know it's going to sound great.

The prices on anything vintage Fender just keep going up and up. If the amp isn't worth a grand right now it will be next year, just wait for it. That's the way the vintage market is going, just pick a price and wait for it.

If it's a thousand dollar amp it seems petty to bitch about twenty bucks worth of covering material. Do it right and it will be a thousand dollar amp, like I said if not right now then sooner or later. Bear in mind that pristine original gear is supposed to be the "investment grade" stuff so that's where the big bucks are. Poor condition or amateur restoration works out the same value-wise and that's not just guitars and amps, that applies to antiques, collectibles, etc..

Speaking of "sooner or later"... why assign equal priority to the functional restoration and the cosmetic restoration? I'd focus on making the amp work well and I'd ignore the cosmetic restoration. You have a natural relic there. Relics are hot right now. It's your amp so do what you will.

You never know, an original cabinet in better condition may show up especially if you keep your eye on eBay.

Okay, I tried charcoal lighter fluid. The spray paint just laughed at that. I need to bring out the strong stuff now. What should I use? Naturally, I'll try it on an inconspicuous spot first.

Paint stripper will lift the paint but the chemicals may attack the tolex. I keep a gallon of nasty nasty old aircraft stripper around, there must be a dozen banned chemicals and carcinogens in that stuff! Screw it, lead vapor hasn't killed me yet so I must be immortal. (cue choking, gagging and croaking noises!)

Try to find a scrub brush with natural bristles. Wait for the stripper to lift the paint then scrub it off with the brush. Some strippers will melt a brush with plastic bristles which is why I'd have second thoughts about using stripper on tolex.

Hey, I just had an idea. Call DuPont or PPG, see if they'll hook you up with an engineer in Customer Service. Ask for their suggestion for a chemical stripper that will remove automotive paint from plastic bumpers without ruining the plastic.

The grill cloth is also painted. I think I might order new grill cloth and try aging it a bit. What's your take on that?

That's easy and you'll be glad you have a Princeton not a Bassman. Lay your new grille out in a cake pan and soak it in strong tea. I prefer to soak the grille flat rather than rolled for a more even color. Use cool tea. You should be able to get four Princeton grilles out of a yard so you have latitude to experiment.

Between heat and chemicals I'm sure we'll find a couple ways to ruin material.

[Lonely Raven]

I've used a tea and coffee mix before. Worked out well.


If you get tired of this ugly old brown/black amp...sell it to me as is! I'll take on the challenge!