Henry Kaiser's Green Dumble?

[odourboy]

Not sure if this head has been discussed before (couldn't find anything with search), but I'm curious if anyone knows what's under the hood of Henry's green suede Dumble demo'd here by Doug Doppler:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34Y3lHpK ... re=related

Styling suggests a 4th generation classic, but I don't know.

(Doug gets some nice OD tones in the later parts if you haven't seen these before)

[amplifiednation]

Not sure if this head has been discussed before (couldn't find anything with search), but I'm curious if anyone knows what's under the hood of Henry's green suede Dumble demo'd here by Doug Doppler:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34Y3lHpK ... re=related

Styling suggests a 4th generation classic, but I don't know.

(Doug gets some nice OD tones in the later parts if you haven't seen these before)

The one with all the crazy colored knobs? I think that head was recovered, the triangle fills in the corners of the contour cutout just can't be authentic.

[jelle]

If I recall correctly, that amp was a combo first. It sounds and feels great. Mr. Dumble sure did a real nice job on that amp. Jelle

[Max]

Styling suggests a 4th generation classic, but I don't know.

AFAIR in one of these four videos Doug demonstrates the influence that the deep switch has on the tone of this ODS. If you listen to this demonstration of the deep switch, you'll probably be able to judge, if it's still the usual deep switch of the "classic" tone stack, or if this ODS has been updated to skyline specs.

Have fun!

Max

[Max]

the triangle fills in the corners of the contour cutout just can't be authentic.

There are original cabinets with fills in these corners:

The first "transition generation" ODS amps with already a "classic" tone stack and already a "standard" OD circuit ("trigger" trim pot, "ratio" control, snubbers etc.) have cabinets with contour cutouts with rather steep angles (see the attached picture of #0075 in Alexander's catalogue). And on at least some of these original cabinets you'll find such fills, too.

A good example for such an ODS with such a kind of cabinet is ODS #0075, the ODS of Steve Farris:

"Transition generation" silver chassis with AFAIK already a "classic" tone stack, a full grown presence control on the front, a ratio control on the back, a stereo jack for the loop and AFAIK already a "standard" OD circuit with a "trigger" trim pot and snubbers etc.. AFAIK #0075 has the same more general circuit specs (but of course with the special "Farris tweaks") as e.g. #124 or #102 had, before #124 and #102 have been updated to skyline specs in the late eighties.

And if you look at the attached pictures of #0075, you'll see the fills in the corners of the contour cutouts of this typical "transition generation" ODS and cabinet.

picture sources:
http://www.audities.org/audities/collec ... ble_1.html
http://www.audities.org/audities/collec ... ve_a1.html
http://www.roblivesey.com/dumble/ "Catalogues"
http://www.maverick-music.com/vintage-a ... eve-farris

Cheers,

Max

[amplifiednation]

Max, you are too good... you are correct, the steeper angles require the fill spots, I guess I never spotted that on any of the cabs until now. I wonder if HAD adjusted the angle of the cut out to avoid those triangles. Even if you pay close attention to them and cut them in perfectly, over time they seem to shrink and look a bit unprofessional. It can be a tough stretch with some tolexes.

[odourboy]

Styling suggests a 4th generation classic, but I don't know.

AFAIR in one of these four videos Doug demonstrates the influence that the deep switch has on the tone of this ODS. If you listen to this demonstration of the deep switch, you'll probably be able to judge, if it's still the usual deep switch of the "classic" tone stack, or if this ODS has been updated to skyline specs.

Have fun!

Max

He demos the deep switch at 3:34 of the Part 2 video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNSAj6Az ... re=related

Frankly, sounds pretty much the same to me. I've only ever heard a deep switch with a Skyline stack, and it was not that subtle. Thoughts?

[Dr d]

This amp was given as an example, in the files section, of a low plate classic. Dont know if this is accurate or not.

[Max]

Thoughts?

IMO the differences between the "on" and "off" positions of this deep switch that can be perceived in this clip point into the direction of a usual deep switch and not into the direction of a mid switch. Even in such a low fi YouTube clip the mid boost of a mid switch would probably be rather obvious.

And IMO all these four clips point more into the direction of an ODS with "classic" specs. These high gain "shred" sounds with this Ibanez into the FET input e.g. are IMO more typical for a "classic" ODS with a "standard" OD than for the OD sound of a "skyline" ODS with a standard OD.

Perhaps Jelle knows more. AFAIR he met this amp not long ago.

Cheers,

Max

[odourboy]

Appreciate your opinion Max and I agree with your conclusion.

[Max]

IMO listening to Robben Ford using #102 before and after its "skyline update" gives a very good idea of the differences between the more general timbre and character of a "classic" ODS and a "skyline" ODS.

Just listen to some of the #102 tracks recorded in the mid eighties, like "Talk To Your Daughter" or the Miles Davis stuff e.g, when #102 still was a "classic" ODS, and compare the more general tone of these recordings with some of the #102 tracks from the nineties, after #102 had been updated to "skyline" specs.

IMO this is a very meaningful and educational comparison, because what you hear is the same player, sometimes even with the same kind of guitar, using the very same ODS amp, but at first with "classic" specs and later with "skyline" specs.

This comparison is very easy to do by looking and listening to videos of Robben Ford's live performances, too:

When you see #102 on stage in its first cabinet with the Vox grill, then what you listen to is the tone of #102 with "classic" specs.

When you see #102 on stage in its second black cabinet or in its third and current tan cabinet, then what you listen to is the tone of #102 updated to "skyline" specs.

Cheers,

Max

[jelle]

Yes, I played that amp briefly and got to hear some others too. It's hard to say for sure because of the age of the amp and more specifically the possibly old age of electrolytic caps and tubes, I would say it is a highplate classic tonestack amp. It has a deep switch.

FWIW, I do not understand why the tolex inserts are needed. It's perfectly possible to do without if the angle is a bit less. I guess he liked that angle at that time....

Below is how I do mine.

[amplifiednation]

Yes, I played that amp briefly and got to hear some others too. It's hard to say for sure because of the age of the amp and more specifically the possibly old age of electrolytic caps and tubes, I would say it is a highplate classic tonestack amp. It has a deep switch.

FWIW, I do not understand why the tolex inserts are needed. It's perfectly possible to do without if the angle is a bit less. I guess he liked that angle at that time....

Below is how I do mine.

Jelle do you do your own suede? The contour cutout is a piece of cake with the cuts placed in the right spots, and the angle isn't too steep.

[groovtubin]

Not sure if this head has been discussed before (couldn't find anything with search), but I'm curious if anyone knows what's under the hood of Henry's green suede Dumble demo'd here by Doug Doppler:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34Y3lHpK ... re=related

Styling suggests a 4th generation classic, but I don't know.

(Doug gets some nice OD tones in the later parts if you haven't seen these before)

Would def say a KILLER pos feedback loop is being used!


jim@Omegaamps

[jelle]

Yes, I played that amp briefly and got to hear some others too. It's hard to say for sure because of the age of the amp and more specifically the possibly old age of electrolytic caps and tubes, I would say it is a highplate classic tonestack amp. It has a deep switch.

FWIW, I do not understand why the tolex inserts are needed. It's perfectly possible to do without if the angle is a bit less. I guess he liked that angle at that time....

Below is how I do mine.

Jelle do you do your own suede? The contour cutout is a piece of cake with the cuts placed in the right spots, and the angle isn't too steep.

Not anymore, I have found a shop that does really nice work, just as anal as I am.... I send them suede to cover my cabinets.