Single Coil Question - D'Lite 22/33

[wjdunham]

It's tough to get a single setup that works perfectly with both IMO. You can come close but I feel you need to compromise a bit to get something that works for single coils AND humbuckers. The balance in frequencies coming out of the pickups is too different.
A few simple things I've found getting the most out of single coils:
1) increase the OD entrance trimmer a bit- more gain for the lower strat output, can cause a bit of mud/mush with HB's
2) slightly roll off the post OD treble bleed if you have one. Again, can have a negative effect on HB's but balances the high end harshness of single coils
3) JJ 12AX7's - seem to have a more agressive tone that gives single coils a nice bite, these also work well with HB's - this is where I would start as it has the best shot of giving you the best for both guitars.
4) check the voltages on your preamp tubes, slightly higher will give the single coils a nice bite , 200V to 205V - slightly lower may smooth things out a bit if you think it's too harsh. I've found this to be a nice tweak point that doesn't get mentioned too much. Play with the 22K (second dropper) from 16K to 25K you can find lots of nice tones.

I tried the mid cap on a switch and didn't find that it had a huge effect, but others have found it to work well, switching between .01, .02 and .047...
Just my $.02
Bill

[bluesfendermanblues]

Exocet et all, I know the feeling of not quite getting the tones you want with a strat.

Re bluesmaster I have arrived at the following setup:
https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.php?t=14699

Regarding skyliner (#183) I made added a switch as per the schemo above to get 47n mid cap and 100k slope. I tried a LNFB in the #183, but found it useless with a strat, so my suggestion would be to run without LNFB with strat.

The 47n/100k combo actually makes the amp a little brighter, but to my ears it kind of hone in on strat frequencies.

[exocet]

K

Exocet et all, I know the feeling of not quite getting the tones you want with a strat.

Re bluesmaster I have arrived at the following setup:
https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.php?t=14699

Regarding skyliner (#183) I made added a switch as per the schemo above to get 47n mid cap and 100k slope. I tried a LNFB in the #183, but found it useless with a strat, so my suggestion would be to run without LNFB with strat.

The 47n/100k combo actually makes the amp a little brighter, but to my ears it kind of hone in on strat frequencies.

Thanks Blues, it was mainly your work that I was referencing.

[talbany]

One issue most Strat users have with the Skyliner is the mid content..
(250K mid pot and .01 cap)..Plenty of mids for humbuckers but too much for singles.. A couple easy things you can try..

1) If you don't use the Jazz setting modify it for Strat..Instead of the .005 cap on the jazz switch try a .001..This will dump a touch of mids to help sweeten it up..(the .005 can get too scooped)You will also have more range on the tone controls in Jazz mode..Try several different caps there and find one you prefer..

2) You could also add (or if you have) a kind of Deep switch as well..This will dump some mid content as well.. Don't feel like you have to stick with the Dumble value caps here as a little goes a long way..Try several until you find one that suits your guitar speakers etc..This worked well on my second gen ODS..

These switches will effect gain though so you may need to bump up the input volume to compensate..
These might not be the beat all end all but might help and would no doubt be more Strat friendly on an amp such as low plate like a 124..

Sorry for posting so much today bored and waiting on my cable guy..They are never on time..

Tony

[exocet]

One issue most Strat users have with the Skyliner is the mid content..
(250K mid pot and .01 cap)..Plenty of mids for humbuckers but too much for singles..

Tony

Tony, thanks for your input as well.

One thing that confuses me about this particular subject is the frequency spectrum of different guitars v the response curve of the various tone stack configurations. I'm going to experiment with your suggestion of different cap on the Jazz setting to try and get a bit of mid scoop.

Regards

Marc

[stelligan]

1) If you don't use the Jazz setting modify it for Strat..Instead of the .005 cap on the jazz switch try a .001..This will dump a touch of mids to help sweeten it up..(the .005 can get too scooped)You will also have more range on the tone controls in Jazz mode..Try several different caps there and find one you prefer..

Tony

Great idea here. Jazz mode is not good for much IMHO.

[doveman]

Thanks for all the input ... but I think it boils down to ... it's hard to get a set up that works with both single coils and humbuckers. That's the reason I really don't want to fool around with the amp too much. Humbuckers ... it's just what I want.

The good news is ... I have a Richter Tweed 5E3 with 6L6s and VVR. It works well with pedals. Maybe I'll just create a setup that works with single coils on the Tweed. Pick my flavor ... going out the door ... D-Style/HB or Tweed/SC.

Also, the D'Lite doesn't have a Jazz switch. It has Bright, OD/Clean & PAB. You know I never use the bright switch.

[bluesfendermanblues]

Don't give up on using Dumble amps with strats.

Just because the D amps we tend to study the most (#102, #183 and BM) are voiced for Humbuckers, I hounestly think the 47n/100k (and no LNFB) is the ticket to great strat sounds with a D amp. Don't think you need #124's low plates, which can be a challenge for good OD sounds.

BTW way (and not to be hippocratic) I'm planning a couple of tweeds - a 5E3 Deluxe and a 5F4 Super. The latter has the best strat tones I have ever heard in real life.

Back in 1992 one of my local music stores had a tweed 5F4 clone..... unfortunately, I don't remember if it was a THD, Kendrick or Victoria???.... but that amp had some of the sweetest strat blues tones I have ever enjoyed in an amp.

[Dr d]

Don't give up on using Dumble amps with strats.

Just because the D amps we tend to study the most (#102, #183 and BM) are voiced for Humbuckers, I hounestly think the 47n/100k (and no LNFB) is the ticket to great strat sounds with a D amp. Don't think you need #124's low plates, which can be a challenge for good OD sounds.

BTW way (and not to be hippocratic) I'm planning a couple of tweeds - a 5E3 Deluxe and a 5F4 Super. The latter has the best strat tones I have ever heard in real life.

Back in 1992 one of my local music stores had a tweed 5F4 clone..... unfortunately, I don't remember if it was a THD, Kendrick or Victoria???.... but that amp had some of the sweetest strat blues tones I have ever enjoyed in an amp.

Have been playing with this (47n/100k) configuration on my BM and it DOES sound great with strats. So it should...we are in Twin territory here!!!!

[Teleguy61]

Great thread for us S/C guys everyone!
Tony-your input is ALWAYS welcome, on any subject.
Thanks to all-
George

[doveman]

I'm wondering ... since I don't use the bright switch ... if I might modify that switch to a sort of SC/HB switch with some of these ideas.

[crbowman]

Doveman,
I know this is probably the most expensive rout to go but......
Might be time to build yourself a new amp voiced for single coils and leave your DLite as is for humbuckers.
As for boosters, I use a BYOC tri-boost. It has three boost modes, one is FET, one is silicon transistor, and one is germanium transistor (like a Range Master).
Each has it's own unique character. Might be something in there that suits you.

[exocet]

Doveman,
I know this is probably the most expensive rout to go but......
Might be time to build yourself a new amp voiced for single coils and leave your DLite as is for humbuckers.
As for boosters, I use a BYOC tri-boost. It has three boost modes, one is FET, one is silicon transistor, and one is germanium transistor (like a Range Master).
Each has it's own unique character. Might be something in there that suits you.

What we are concluding here is that getting a good sound from a Strat S/C is not just a simple matter of gain boosting, you also need to have tone shaping as well. I haven't tried the Xotic AC / RC type pedal but I know that they have active Bass & Treble controls that might help to bring a Strat 'into line' so to speak?

I still think that you need to fit a switch to defeat the LNFB before a clean boost will give the desired effect but that's just my opinion.

Not wishing to derail this thread but what is it about the frequency spectrum produced by a Strat that makes it a bit of a mismatch for a standard high plate skyliner? After all, my single coil Telecaster neck pickup sounds fantastic providing that I don't drive the gain too high - then it gets mushy but I can find plenty of good sounds up until that point is reached. I guess from what Tony said, it's all about the midrange content?

[talbany]

Tony said, it's all about the midrange content?

exo
I wouldn't nessicarly say it's all about midrange content!!..Low plates are also a part of it..Low plates will clip differently effecting frequency response and harmonic content...They also have less gain and feel different than a high plate.. Bill mentions preamp voltages where IMO voltages there also effects tone and feel(I prefer slightly higher voltages with singles)..Global NFB is another part of it..
Humbuckers can have higher output and most of the time more low end so sometimes more NFB at the power amp side is needed to keep things tight on the way out where singles to me sound better with less NFB slightly loose and more harmonic content on the top end to give it that Strat-ty chime we like..Then there slope resistors/Mid pot values/ LNFB V1/Fet circuit/ Preamp, power amp tubes,pickups on and on.. guess my point here is..It all effects tone and balance so where do you begin to advise someone that says they don't like the tone of SC out of there amps..It could be a few tweaks or many to get you there..

My post on the Jazz rock will address some of these issues but certainly not all and like I said not the beat all end all solution but an easy change that might help..
IMO..I am not sure if we are so used to the classic Fender tone growing up and wanting to capture that sound here so we gravitate in that direction out of instinct..I know I do..

BTW My fave in this order for singles are 2nd Gen/Low Plate Classics/ BM


Hope this helps!!...But probably won't..

Tony

[exocet]

Thanks Tony, that was a gross simplification on my part!!