Rocket w/ Reverb

[M Fowler]

Ange suggested Saratov El84 tubes I believe. Any one else have good experiences with them?

I have heard that that would be a good choice I just haven't made the call to the man yet

[rooster]

Hey, on the subject of Saratov's, can anybody who has this quad pull one, take a pic and post it here? And then could sombody who is running the Sovtek EL84M take a picture of it and post it, too? Is it the same tube? Or is it one of the other three that NewSensor sells?

The reason I ask is because I am very confused by the fact that the Reflector facility, now named 'ExpoPUL' is the only tube factory in Saratov. Is there some voodoo here with the date of manufacture of the tubes? Are what some are calling 'Saratov' EL84s just Sovtek EL84Ms?

Man, if somone has a handle on this, I am all ears. Thanks.

[Ian444]

Here's a pic of a 6P14P-EV Reflektor 1986. I like the Reflector tubes from the 80's, they seem to be very consistent. I am not used to the "Saratov" description of tubes, confusing, yes. Hope the pic helps, Santa brought me a cheap mini tripod for closeups, seems to work well compared to a hand-held shot

[angelodp]

Here is one of the quads I purchased from the Sarge.

[IMG2556]http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii9/ ... aratov.jpg[/img]

[rooster]

Woah, you guys are very nice people! Thank you both!

Funny thing here is, even between these two pics, the plates are different. This first one has one rectanglular hole in the middle, the second one has the middle one but then two added, one top and one bottom. Yet they both have that logo thing going on and crazy numbering that I do not understand.

OK, does anybody have that EL84M pic?

Here are is my internet special pics of the EL84M, and then the ElectroHarmonix EL84. Note the similarity to Angel's pic and the EL84EH, bad reso and all, and the similarity to the EL84M and the first posted pic.

[Ian444]

The JJ EL84 is different to all of the above too.

[rooster]

It is, Ian444, and I think all of us here have tried them or are using them, sure, understood.

My quest concerns the Ken Fischer's documented taste for the EL84M and how it relates to the 'Saratov' tube some folks are using here.

So I am just trying to figure this out, whether it's something that I have to buy only from the Tube Sargent or if one of the current production EL84s from Saratov is the same thing. And actually, since the factory is the same one it's been for 40 odd years, why has sorting this out become so convoluted?

And here I think more pics will help. While it's true, the metal may (or may not) have changed over the years, and that could be a factor, yes. However, if the construction is the same, then I think I would just buy some current issue Russian EL84 rather than chase something down a rabbit hole. Well, not to say all who have purchased the 'Saratov' EL84 have thrown crazy $$ away. But rather that it is a very typical practice for tubes to be relabeled as something else when it's actually the same tube - and I would rather spend the extra $$ on something else. Honestly, I can't help but think that something like this is going on with this tube. Great example of tube relabeling would be the Mullard GZ34 or the Siemens EL34 just to name two - although most of us these days, with the benefit of pics and physical examples, have sorted this confusion out by now.

And frankly, looking at the construction of the 4 individual tubes in the pics, it looks to me that I am looking at two pairs of tubes. And the ones described as the 'Saratov' brand are plainly different looking internally, yet both are thought of as the 'Saratov' to own. How can this be?

Also, FWIW, when talking to New Sensor, (the American owner of this tube manufacturing facilities in Saratov), they point out that the EL84EH and the EL84M will take the highest plate voltages of the 5 different kinds that they produce. Er, the five versions being Sovtek (EL84 and EL84M), Genelex (EL84), ElectroHarmonix (EL84EH), and Mullard (EL84). BTW, these are all produced in Saratov at the formerly called Reflektor but now called Expo/PUL factory.

Wouldn't you think a bunch of tube obsessed amp builders could figure this out?

So gentlemen let's see some more pics, please?

[amplifiednation]

So I digress on the headroom of the rocket. my god does that thing get loud before it breaks up. i can attenuate it down -12db with a resistor based device i made but without it i will give myself an ear splitting headache.

The cleans are phenomenal with just a tad of natural tube breakup, the tone is really sweet. The reverb section gives a nice "air" to the notes that doesn't seem to fade out at all. I installed the resistor to pad out the verb at higher levels, which definitely seems to be a nice touch. When pushed the sustain of the amp is quite appealing, the notes are there to stay.

I'm getting a little bit of crackle on my bass notes on the low E and A strings in the upper register (like 9th to 12th position), but that is it...any ideas what that might be? I was thinking maybe a cold solder joint?? I have no idea. It's not happening on other notes. I tried two different cabs i have and get the same crackle.

What "break in" experience should I be expecting? I was hoping the crackle might just be something normal that will go away, but it's pretty consistant. Very subtle, but there.

[Zippy]

I'm getting a little bit of crackle on my bass notes on the low E and A strings in the upper register (like 9th to 12th position), but that is it...any ideas what that might be? I was thinking maybe a cold solder joint?? I have no idea. It's not happening on other notes. I tried two different cabs i have and get the same crackle.

Is it independent of guitar? I have witnessed such response in guitars with a lil' hump in the fingerboard and the pickup(s) set too close to the strings. Elusive to nail down but it was there - and real easy to fix once identified.

[amplifiednation]

I'm getting a little bit of crackle on my bass notes on the low E and A strings in the upper register (like 9th to 12th position), but that is it...any ideas what that might be? I was thinking maybe a cold solder joint?? I have no idea. It's not happening on other notes. I tried two different cabs i have and get the same crackle.

Is it independent of guitar? I have witnessed such response in guitars with a lil' hump in the fingerboard and the pickup(s) set too close to the strings. Elusive to nail down but it was there - and real easy to fix once identified.

You know what, I JUST had the guitar set up. I'm gonna plug it in to my other amp.

[Zippy]

You know what, I JUST had the guitar set up. I'm gonna plug it in to my other amp.

Did you ask for the "action as low as possible"? Gads, how I learned to loathe that kind of request when I was working in a guitar repair shop.

Do you also have another guitar to plug into your Rocket? Some amps are more sensitive than others to such anomalies.

Keep us posted as to outcomes.

G'luck!

[M Fowler]

Rooster I just use JJ EL84's and call it good. I wanted to order the Sartov but never did.

I do have a set of the Russian 6P14P-EV tubes for my wreck build.

Not sure what to think about your statement above about being the same tube and all.

Mark

[amplifiednation]

You know what, I JUST had the guitar set up. I'm gonna plug it in to my other amp.

Did you ask for the "action as low as possible"? Gads, how I learned to loathe that kind of request when I was working in a guitar repair shop.

Do you also have another guitar to plug into your Rocket? Some amps are more sensitive than others to such anomalies.

Keep us posted as to outcomes.

G'luck!

Haha, no I didn't. I just tried the guitar in another amp and all was good, but raised it up just a tad anyway and the buzz is gone on the rocket.

Rocket gets a little muddy when cranked but cleans up to a nice crunch with the cut control turned up past 9 o clock. would a bright switch give the same kind of effect? it's almost like adding in the mids is what brings out some definition. The boost is truly a very cool option to have switchable.

[angelodp]

Yup, the dual bright switch I have is just the right touch on certain guitars, SG, LP.

[ampbldr2]

I have drawn up a preliminary "RocketReverb" schematic that i need to complete the wiring of the reverb transformer. This is based off of the rocketreverblayout.pdf. Considering i have never built one of these before and not seeing all the connections in the layout i felt a schematic would be needed for me to actually complete the build.

Well here it is. If anyone can help would be greatly appreciated. I need to know what reverb transformer or transformers could be used as well.

I can also add the voltage chart if anyone has that info.