What would you do?

[overtone]

Six days later and still no resolution, merely a video of a defect that the supplier has already agreed to make good.
Randal, your statement about your brand name really makes no sense. Surely you will test any replacements before you put your brand name on?

The options are on the table, you have customers still waiting and now TAG members understandably wanting you to name names.
From here it looks like you are still holding onto the problem. Time to put this one to bed.

[katopan]

I've just done my first toner transfer direct to a polished aluminium chassis, and it's more robust than that! In fact I made a mistake with the alignment on the first attempt and thought "no trouble, I'll wipe it off with turps like I do with my PCB toner transfers and have another go". Absolutely didn't move. Ended up having to polish it off with Brasso and even that took a fair bit of elbow grease to get it off.

[dorrisant]

Not to derail... but, Katopan, what did you use for the transfers there? It looks great!

Tony

[katopan]

Sorry for the distraction. We're talking quality of a commercial product and I bring up diy stuff.

Tony, I've been playing with toner transfer PCBs with magazine paper for about 10 years, but never got it working well for text/graphics. Recently came across threads discussing the use of printable vinyl, and a guy from New Zealand said he'd also used Contact brand book covering which is readily available here in Oz. Bought a roll for under $3 and it works a treat. Stick Contact onto normal paper. Run it through the laser printer. Heat transfer and peel off. No residue, no soaking the paper off. Just the toner and it's as robust as screen print. Toner transfer success is all about getting enough heat, and on the chassis I had to hit the back with a heat gun on hi as well as a clothes iron on the front to get it hot enough. Wait 'til you see the wooden faceplate.... done the same way but no where near as much heat. Can't wait to try it on clear acrylic faceplates. I should raise a thread on this amp over here at some stage.

Sorry, back to the regular program.

[Structo]

Getting back to Randall's problem, that video simply shows how easily the letters rub off.

That is totally unacceptable for a production amp, let alone a custom build using a aftermarket chassis.

I have read reports of problems with printing on chrome plated chassis, since it is such a smooth surface but, there are 50 year old Fender chassis that still have lettering on them so we know it can be done.

Hopefully, the vendor will step up and make it right.

[Randall]

Let's not turn this into a lynching or a dispute with a known vendor before all the facts are in. I am in contact with customer service, and we are trying to figure this out. As you can see from my video, my two chassis lettering comes off with only a rub of my thumb, ruling out the 'chemical' variable.

However the vendor is saying he cannot recreate that on his end. He has created his own videos clearly showing the chassis that he has being rubbed, then doused with Windex and wiped with no ill effects. He has requested I post them along side mine for help with brainstorming why the stark differences.

And for the record, I was offered replacements for both.

http://s668.photobucket.com/user/Randal ... 3.mp4.html

http://s668.photobucket.com/user/Randal ... 3.mp4.html

[M Fowler]

Well Randall you did come to us TAG guys for discussion so we gave you our opinion.

I would be using blank aluminum 5E3 size chassis with faceplate if it were my production amp, but that's just how I operate. Easier to go prepunched for sure but limited with logo and faceplate options then.

[ToneMerc]

Let's not turn this into a lynching or a dispute with a known vendor before all the facts are in. I am in contact with customer service, and we are trying to figure this out. As you can see from my video, my two chassis lettering comes off with only a rub of my thumb, ruling out the 'chemical' variable.

However the vendor is saying he cannot recreate that on his end. He has created his own videos clearly showing the chassis that he has being rubbed, then doused with Windex and wiped with no ill effects. He has requested I post them along side mine for help with brainstorming why the stark differences.

And for the record, I was offered replacements for both.

http://s668.photobucket.com/user/Randal ... 3.mp4.html

http://s668.photobucket.com/user/Randal ... 3.mp4.html

Well, based on what you said then it appears to be just a lot of chassis that the screen didn't take and you were offered replacements.....end of story then and enough with all the drama.

TM

[Randall]

Well Randall you did come to us TAG guys for discussion so we gave you our opinion.

Yes you did, and I value those opinions. This is a fluid situation that takes time. At first the question was, is this a defect, and should I leave it or change it out? Since then it has evolved into it certainly is a defect, and no, I can't live with it in two amps I have already sold.

Next is what to do? Trust a replacement from the same batch or not? To believe I have the only two bad ones from a supplier, or go elsewhere? Or find another reason why mine have failed and the vendors have not? This takes time.

If you had to tear apart two perfectly good builds because your chassis failed, would you automatically go for replacements from the same place? I bet bet you wouldn't.

But, after discussion and what I am sure now will be a serious vetting by the vendor I will try two replacements, as of today. We shall see.

Did I get the only two bad chassis in stock? I don't know. Should I have named the vendor before this got resolved? Absolutely not. Does that make this drama? Not in my view. Am I unhappy at having to rip out two painstakingly built 5E3s? You know it.

[M Fowler]

I would never tear two good working amps apart when I could use a faceplate to solve the issue.

[Randall]

Covering a problem with a face plate wouldn't work for me, even if I did have an easy and proven source to do it. But, that's me I guess.

[dorrisant]

This is me not knowing how to delete a double post.

... Nope, you apparently know what to do...

Just sayin' I would be pissed to have to swap chassis. That would have to account for something. Time ain't free. Hope you get a good resolution.

I'm curious though, how would covering it with a faceplate cause you problems? Wouldn't match what you've made before? I could understand that. With a 5e3 it is too easy to make a faceplate work.

Mark has a valid point though, a blank aluminum chassis has the benefit of contributing to noise reduction and if you don't like the looks of the faceplate you can change it too.

I definitely like the idea of having the trophy shops making them on the cheap. Even when we etch, you don't pay much for a blank faceplate but you can sure spend some time on them!

Tony

[Randall]

Nah. I want it right the first time, that's my discipline. That's what my customers want in re-pros in this case. I will delve into the face plate discussion at some point, but this is not the time.

[Firestorm]

Nah. I want it right the first time, that's my discipline. That's what my customers want in re-pros in this case. I will delve into the face plate discussion at some point, but this is not the time.

Then you've answered your own question; you have no choice but to "rechassis". Especially if you've been offered replacements.

[Smokebreak]

Nah. I want it right the first time, that's my discipline. That's what my customers want in re-pros in this case. I will delve into the face plate discussion at some point, but this is not the time.

Then you've answered your own question; you have no choice but to "rechassis". Especially if you've been offered replacements.

Sure, it's frustrating sometimes, but rebuilds can be fun. Look at it as a way to improve your grounding. If you are branding production amps, I imagine you'll need to build a couple from scratch, and not kits from...who?
I'm not sure who not to buy from now.
I don't mean to be rude, but to your concern, you could punch your own chassis next time, and find a professional to print on it.
For now, if your customers really have to have that new 5E3 look, enjoy the rebuild, and maybe expose them to the beauty of custom to change their minds.
Who really wants white decals on chrome anymore anyway.
Of course you could solve all of this through BNP or your local trophy shop.