Landmines or crickets

[ic-racer]

Actually I had a similar conversation with Larry, Robben, Sonny, and Eric Johnson a few years back at a festival in Copper, CO called Guitar Town.

Thanks for your contribution. Your 'first-hand' experiences dispel many myths. Excellent post.

[Structo]

Excellent!

[FUCHSAUDIO]

Let's say I respect the innovative nature, but spare me the uneccessary drama...

[ayan]

Actually I had a similar conversation with Larry, Robben, Sonny, and Eric Johnson a few years back at a festival in Copper, CO called Guitar Town.

Thanks for your contribution. Your 'first-hand' experiences dispel many myths. Excellent post.

Well, I love Brandon and Larry Carlton has been a tremendous force guitar-wise in my life since I heard him play in "The Art of Tea" (recorded in 1975). However, as unpopular as this may sound, if Larry had sounded in the 70s and 80s the way he sounds now, I would definitely not be as familiar with his work as I am... I appreciate the quote that the overdrive in his amps may sound cheap and that he may have gotten rid of the Dumbleator. Yet, I don't believe anyone, but perhaps Larry himself, can argue with the sound he used to get out of his amp and Dumbletor back in the 80s. He could get a similar sound with a Mesa Boogie Mk III -- I got a video of him with one from "Night Visions" -- yet he chooses to go for something different now. So, cheap or not, overdrive seems to not be in Larry's corsshais in the same way anymore and that, to me, is the bottom line.

Gil

[FUCHSAUDIO]

No surprise you and I once-again agree Gil. His work with the Jazz Crusaders, Michael Franks, Joni Mitchell, Steely Dan, all drew me to Larry as a major fan. BTW: Saw The Dan a few weeks back and Jon Herrington nails both the tone and styles of every era Dan guitarist bar none... If Larry had the same tones from his current era back then, I might have not been as engaged by his playing. That's no slap at Brandon or Dumble, but he's evolved to something that's just not as good imho.

Last Nite is a benchmark album for D-tone's and Larry playing, and should remastered and reissued imho.

Robben on the other hand (for whatever reasons) has remained tonally more consistent over time. I still listen to his work with Jimmy Witherspoon (which was blackface Super and a big jazz box) and he still sounded like him. Perhaps todays tones are a little more modern versions, but the tones back then, (even the early Yellowjackets stuff on Fenders and /or Yamaha solid state stuff) it's STILL RObben's tone.

[Fischerman]

I know from people close to him that when he gets to service "Magical" amps for people (Fenders, Marshalls, selmers, voxes, etc.) he really takes time to try and figure out what makes that particular amp magical, be it lead dress, components, transformers, and the like, then he applies those ideas to his own designs.

That's what I'm talkin' about...this kind of stuff is why I started the thread. So hopefully the happy accidents can be more 'by design'.

I just didn't know what to make of the 'landmines' comment...I had visions of HAD painting over thin colored bands on resistors...components that were actually 'shorts'...stuff mounted under the board...etc. And it wasn't so much the actual values (if applicable)...but more along the lines of: "Why did he go to the trouble of putting this particular landmine here?"

[FUCHSAUDIO]

He is obsessive. I've seen a few amps where the choke or output transformer had labels or pencil writing with resistance and inductance values were tested and noted. There are also test points on the HRM stack cards (sticking out of the goop) to measure something....

[erwin_ve]

He is obsessive. I've seen a few amps where the choke or output transformer had labels or pencil writing with resistance and inductance values were tested and noted. There are also test points on the HRM stack cards (sticking out of the goop) to measure something....

Isn't the OT resistance and inductance and impedance important for a precise calculation of available power and precise biasing?

[FUCHSAUDIO]

It also affects the frequency response and tone of an amp too. Obviously, these are parameters HAD felt strongly about knowing and approving.

[Funkalicousgroove]

Actually I had a similar conversation with Larry, Robben, Sonny, and Eric Johnson a few years back at a festival in Copper, CO called Guitar Town.

Thanks for your contribution. Your 'first-hand' experiences dispel many myths. Excellent post.

Well, I love Brandon and Larry Carlton has been a tremendous force guitar-wise in my life since I heard him play in "The Art of Tea" (recorded in 1975). However, as unpopular as this may sound, if Larry had sounded in the 70s and 80s the way he sounds now, I would definitely not be as familiar with his work as I am... I appreciate the quote that the overdrive in his amps may sound cheap and that he may have gotten rid of the Dumbleator. Yet, I don't believe anyone, but perhaps Larry himself, can argue with the sound he used to get out of his amp and Dumbletor back in the 80s. He could get a similar sound with a Mesa Boogie Mk III -- I got a video of him with one from "Night Visions" -- yet he chooses to go for something different now. So, cheap or not, overdrive seems to not be in Larry's corsshais in the same way anymore and that, to me, is the bottom line.

Gil

You know, I had this discussion with LC a couple months ago, he was actually quite surprised to know that people are so GaGa over the Last nite tones, but he just doesn't like using overdrive, he says it "pinches" the high end- Who am I to argue?

IMHO His coolest tones were on Renegade Gentleman, which was a Steel String Singer- Go figure!

[mlp-mx6]

My opinions (for what THAT is worth):

Larry's best playing - Last Nite and Sleepwalk. His first two are excellent as well, but the Boogie-style tone is not my favorite - too thin. The double-speed solo on "Mulberry Street" is simply amazing for the relentless inventiveness, even though it sounds a little strange an octave up.

Larry's best tones - Last Nite and On Solid Ground (and the Christmas album he did, also excellent).

Fire Wire just did not grab me at all. For some reason, neither did Renegade Gentleman.

[ayan]

You know, I had this discussion with LC a couple months ago, he was actually quite surprised to know that people are so GaGa over the Last nite tones, but he just doesn't like using overdrive, he says it "pinches" the high end- Who am I to argue?

IMHO His coolest tones were on Renegade Gentleman, which was a Steel String Singer- Go figure!

Hey Brandon! I remember you and I having that conversation and I guess we both kind of wondered back then. Part of the thing I don't understand is when people do a bit of a 180 like that, of course they're entitled... I was very happy when Sapphire Blue came out, I think that is one of Larry's finest, and it clearly shows LC still has everything that made me so excited about his playing in the first place. If he would only flex that muscle a little more often. I hope there is more of that to come in his future.

Cheers,

Gil

[FUCHSAUDIO]

Fire Wire just did not grab me at all. For some reason, neither did Renegade Gentleman.

Me neither...go figure.

[Fischerman]

Just curious but...do any of you guys ever build an amp with, say, an OT model that you've used with success many times before (say a Twin Reverb OT) but for whatever reason that particular OT just sounds like shit? I don't think I build enough to know.

LC question: EDIT...this probably needed a new thread.

[FUCHSAUDIO]

Just curious but...do any of you guys ever build an amp with, say, an OT model that you've used with success many times before (say a Twin Reverb OT) but for whatever reason that particular OT just sounds like shit? I don't think I build enough to know.

LC question: EDIT...this probably needed a new thread.

We've been pretty lucky in production. With modifications it's sometimes a crap shoot, where a particular transformer or platform you've used before doesn't sound like you expected.