First build: AB763

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Structo
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by Structo »

While it is very possible to build it from scratch, I suggest a kit first as you need very good knowledge of components to order them.

Especially from Mouser.
While they have a very broad range of components, I don't think I am alone when I say I have received stuff that wasn't exactly what I thought it would be.

There is a definite learning curve to ordering from the electronics super stores.

If you can afford it, build a kit the first time, you will learn a lot and the next build will be easier and more fun because of it. :wink:
Tom

Don't let that smoke out!
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rogb
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by rogb »

A kit is a great idea Tom! There are a few good choices around too.
Here's one from Mojotone, I couldn't get a sensible shipping price though...
According to their info, "Made famous by artists such as Ray Buchanan" :D

Mojotone Blackface Deluxe Reverb Style Head Kit

Export Version?: Export 240 Volt
Amp Kit Options: No Tubes / No Cabinet
$631.21

But if you are going to build, sooner or later you need to bite the bullet and figure out how to order parts and what suppliers to use.
Maybe not on the first one, true :D
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rp
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by rp »

Any of you Brits here, or Eurolandians, know of any place that stocks MC Classictone trannies in the EU? It seems not from my searching. I emailed Classictone once to ask if they have a retailer here but never heard back. Sure would be nice if Tube-Town, TAD, Uraltone etc would offer them. Anyone know anyone at these places? Someone could make some money.
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rogb
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by rogb »

rp wrote:Any of you Brits here, or Eurolandians, know of any place that stocks MC Classictone trannies in the EU? It seems not from my searching. I emailed Classictone once to ask if they have a retailer here but never heard back. Sure would be nice if Tube-Town, TAD, Uraltone etc would offer them. Anyone know anyone at these places? Someone could make some money.
I get my MC stuff from Triode. It is a minimum of $80-$100 shipping for a set, plus VAT etc.
It would be great if we could get MC in Euroland but ther is no one AFAIK.
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Structo
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by Structo »

It seems that quite a few Europeans use toroid transformers in their builds.

Seems that they are more available than the standard interleaved transformers seen in many amps.

Might be a cheaper option but do good research before ordering.
Tom

Don't let that smoke out!
Nisto
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by Nisto »

Thanks for the suggestion to look at Classic Tone transformers, it took me to Triode who have an interesting 5e3 kit.

http://store.triodestore.com/5e3tubeampkit.html

I don't mind ordering components, although I haven't built up anything for a long time, my last project was a guitar tuner that I designed and built from scratch. I'm hopeful it will all come back to me once I get started.

I've been looking at soldering irons, my 25 watt Antec has struggled with the small amount of guitar wiring I have done, so it's time to get something with a bit more power.

Nick
Nisto
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by Nisto »

I got in touch with Magnetic Components, they don't have a European distributor because they found the mark up was 2 or 3 times the US price.

Rog, I agree with you about MM, from the video there wasn't enough of a difference to warrant going with them.

I'm about to order a 5e3 kit from Triode. I might look for a UK source for the chassis as I imagine it will cost a bit in postage.

Also, I'm going to invest in a decent soldering iron. I'm looking at the Weller temperature controlled irons but any recommendations are welcome.

Cheers

Nick
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rogb
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by rogb »

Glad to gear you're getting what you want. A 5E3 is a little way from a AB763 soundwise, but a great amp to have.
Can't you get the Triode chassis for $80 at the same time? It will save a lot of messing around.
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renshen1957
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by renshen1957 »

pdf64 wrote:The Allen stuff looks nice but their power transformers only support USA / Canadian line supply (120V 60Hz); there's a specific warning not to use them at 50Hz.
So no good for UK / EU etc residents such as Nick.

Pete
Hi,

Other than the need for a step down transformer, to handle the higher EU voltage, I don't see a problem. The 50 Hz/60Hz issue doesn't make a bit of difference on power or OT transformers.

Filter caps and mains hum (and its harmonics), might make a difference, but that is part of the circuit design.


Best regards,


Steve
Every Tom, Dick, and Harry is named Steve
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jelle
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by jelle »

Efficiency numbers are different for different frequencies.
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M Fowler
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by M Fowler »

Just beware all these different transformer companies and chassis suppliers have different mounting hole and cutout sizes.

If your going to use Magnetic Components transformer you might be better off using the Triodestore chassis that fits those transformers. If your cutting your own chassis holes then never mind. :)

Mark
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renshen1957
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by renshen1957 »

Nisto wrote:Hi All,

After reading a few posts I have been encouraged enough to have a go at my first amp. My first degree was in electronics, although that was 20 years ago and it's been that long since I built up a circuit. I have no real experience of working with valves or audio grade components, so there will be a lot to learn!

I'm based in the UK and looking of a supplier of good quality components in the UK or EU. I had thought I might choose Mercury Magnetics transformers and Sozo caps having heard good things about both companies. I'm hoping I won't need to import them from the US, is there a UK source? I'd like to go for a straight AB763 deluxe build but with good quality components.

Further on down the road, and assuming I get the amp to work, I'll be looking for a deluxe sized combo cab.

I'm interested in any recommendations you can send my way for components and suppliers. I'm sure I'll be asking for a but if help and advice along the way.

Regards

Nick
Hi Nick,

Welcome to the wonderful world of amp building and the forum.

The above quite an ambitious undertaking. I have some suggestions.

Start first with a SE amp, such as a Champ, first. But, I wouldn't just look up an old Fender schematic and layout.

The book that opened my eyes to electronic construction technique, was Kevin O'Connor's The Ultimate Tone, Volume Three. It explained the how's and why's of guitar amp design and contains a variety of amps with layouts, and explanations. The beginning chapters are well worth the price of admission, even if the cost of the book as a tad dear.

Only fault to the book are the illustration weren't as carefully edited as they could have been, occasionally something is omitted in schematic that was in the layout, or vice versa. But building any amp you should always be on the look out for such.

Tino Zottola guitar amp construction books show you to construct stuff, with very good directions. But the books never explained things the way KOC book did. From KOC's books I got ideas how to build better, rather than to just copy.

As an alternative I would suggest some of the projects in Tino Zottola book 1, before going on to a Princeton Reverb, or Fender Twin Reverb in later volumes, if you don't go the kit route.

Frankly there are good and bad kits out there.

I still think the Champ would be a better first project from TUT 3 and a better investment in your education. Build on success.

There are a number of quality components out there. I have used MM, which are good, but pricey. I purchased all but one transformer on ebay auctions at discount. Unless you are going to custom build boutique amps for famous or well-funded musicians, there was enough variation in the old amps that no one will notice if you have a blue-printed MM clone OT in your amp or not, unless you tell them.

If you peruse the list of Fender transformers on the Mercury Magnetic website, you will notice that on many amps (especially the Fender Tweeds), there were many variants or substitutes. So no reason not to substitute with something well built, and preferably local.

On other imported products, I've used Hammonds 1600 series (KOC's influence), but I would equally recommend Edcorusa.com which are currently less expensive, and as well if not better built and better values than Hammond. Magnetic Components make fine transformers, and cost less than MM.

Hopefully, if this is your heart's, you can source these locally.

On importing, UK Customs charges a bloody fortune on stuff sent to the UK. I haven't shipped transformer in flat rate USPS box to the UK (20 lbs equals 9 kilograms), recently but the postage costs $60.00 USD (non flat rate will set you back $100 USD) currently.

I don't believe there are musical instrument part exemptions for Customs duties and local taxes. Unless you can get someone to lie about the value, and say it was a gift or manufacturer sample (and if Customs believes them), expect to pay a king's ransom to get your parcel released from the Royal Post.

KOC in his books said to keep away from Voodoo parts (expensive) and just keep to modern equivalents. Although this is sage advice, I haven't taken it in general.

I have had good experience with NOS USSR caps, Sozos (but Sozo is known to delay shipments at times). I have used Jupiters, NOS Mullard Mustards, Vintage Wima Polystyrene used in the original Vox AC30/4, NOS Mullard tropical fish, etc, and I believe these parts can make a difference, small in some cases, bigger in others.

I purchased these through careful research, and a bit of good luck. But you don't need these to make a great amp.

Some people claim any cap or Metal film resistor works in a circuit and you won't hear a difference.

Maybe to their ears, but not to mine. They might as well state that all speakers sound basically the same and a Chinese 12ax7 sounds no different from a Smooth Plate 1950s Mullard ECC83.

Okay, that's a hyperbole, however differences do exist. Half the fun is finding out which things do make a difference and what works for you and what does not.

But all the expensive parts in the world won't make a sow's ear into a silk purse if wired improperly with poor lead dress. (Tut 3 goes into this) Especially if you have to attempt to correct your mistakes in a lethal voltage environment after the fact.

Try to build with plenty of room, especially the electrical components.

I would build your dream amp (Princeton Reverb) as a head, with the tubes right side up (vintage Marshall style), unless you have your heart on a clone that resembles the original to the Nth degree right down to the Fender Electrical Instrument Company engraved on the front plates. It will last longer, have less issues over time, and be kinder to the tubes. With your eyes closed, either would sound similar. But to my ears, no two amps sound exactly the same.

My two pence worth.

Steve
Every Tom, Dick, and Harry is named Steve
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renshen1957
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by renshen1957 »

jelle wrote:Efficiency numbers are different for different frequencies.
Hi Jelle,

That is true.

But the Beatles UK Vox AC30s didn't seem to sound radically different on the Ed Sullivan Show recordings from the BBC broadcasts. Jimi Hendrix's Marshall's didn't seem to sound different on his various live recordings when he toured in the US and Europe.

A number of amps imported from overseas in classic recordings in either direction across the pond, The Black Face Fender Deluxe used in Nowhere Man or later in the Deluxe and the Silver Face Deluxe Reverb,Get Back/Let it Be sessions.

A Fender Twin is on Jimi Hendrix's earliest singles.

Export versions for Fender might have different PT, but cheapo Fender used the same OT transformers as for the US.

The Blonde Bassman head was used on a number of recordings for the Beatles, one of the few amps that remained in their arsenal of amps, used consistently from 1966 onwards and later by ex-Beatles after the split.

Best regards,

Steve
Every Tom, Dick, and Harry is named Steve
pdf64
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by pdf64 »

Other than the need for a step down transformer, to handle the higher EU voltage, I don't see a problem. The 50 Hz/60Hz issue doesn't make a bit of difference on power or OT transformers
My understanding is that to avoid saturation, more iron will be needed in the magnetic circuit as frequency is reduced.
In use, I agree that an Allen PT would probably work fine, if slightly hotter, at 50Hz.
The issue is that Allen have a policy not to ship (and by implication, support or warranty) kits outside USA and Canada.
Pete
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rp
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Re: First build: AB763

Post by rp »

renshen1957 wrote: But the Beatles UK Vox AC30s didn't seem to sound radically different on the Ed Sullivan Show recordings from the BBC broadcasts. Jimi Hendrix's Marshall's didn't seem to sound different on his various live recordings when he toured in the US and Europe.... Steve
You know, it's all in the fingers :D
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