Mustard caps in Fender amp?

[Dingleberry]

Hi.

After too long week at work and after three IPA's I was just wondering has anyone built a Fender amp with mustard caps?
They always seem to be associated with Vox, Marshall and Hiwatt aka. "The British sound".
(Why they used them was probably just because Philips / Mullard were manufactured in various places across Europe and they were high quality and small tolerance, especially at the time and available just about anywhere in large quantities. Practical reasons mostly)

How would a Fender amp behave with mustards inside?
"More British" I assume

Would it change the character dramatically enough to really hear a difference?

And What's the "general tone" of the mustard caps anyway in practice?
Do they color your tone in some specific way? (of course they will, every component does...) What's the specific way?
Lows - mids - highs?
How are those related in the whole sound spectrum of mustard caps?

Couldn't find a simple answer except: They sound "wonderful", "magnificent", "out of this world", "unbelievable", "you´ll understand when you try" etc.

And I'm talking about the vintage mustards.

Did you get any idea?

-T

[martin manning]

Need a little more info... What kind of IPA?

[Colossal]

Need a little more info... What kind of IPA?

[Structo]

Is that Bridgeport IPA or some other brand?





One only has to look at the first Marshall the JTM 45.

[M Fowler]

That 5b6 is one kool amp. One of my favorites, the longer the amp is on the more it seems to get better whether it's the caps or tubes not sure.

I used what CED called basic coupling caps they look like M150's.

[tubeswell]

I've used mustard caps in several fender clones. Its a matter of what I had on-hand

[Phil_S]

Mustard only works the magic in hot dog amps.

Kidding aside, I've been waiting for someone to do a proper study with a scope and other test instruments to document the differences between caps. I suspect they do color (for OD's) or colour (for mustards) the tone somewhat, but I also suspect there is not much difference even though people emphatically say there is. If you can hear it, then you can document it. That's what I think.

[Dingleberry]

Need a little more info... What kind of IPA?

Goose Island

-T

[martin manning]

Here's an interesting collection of dissected caps and a few comments on their tonal qualities: http://mhuss.com/Capacitors/ I think it would be difficult to measure the kind of subtleties that are being kicked around here, i.e. one brand of film cap vs. another, especially if the film composition is the same. Maybe a sweep generator and a high resolution spectrum analyzer would give some indication that could be correlated with listening perception.

[talbany]

My first post here in the technical discussion side..

For me and FWIW Scopes are pretty uselsess when it comes to the sound (Timbre) and feel of a cap..As long as the cap meets or exceeds the operating points..
In the early days I expiermented with just about all the famous (and not so famous) caps..
IMO certain caps work best in certain amps..
Depending on if that amp is primarily a clean amp or over driven or heavily over driven.. Certain caps will color the sound..Take for example the PS series, as these generally produce a rather open mid range and low end sound stage..The Mallory 150's produce a rather large open low end a more scooped/sweeter mids and slightly darker highs..The Mustards have a choked low end a rather natural sounding mids and a nice open (but smooth ) top end..This is part of the reason why the older Marshalls that use these will cut through the mix..The polystyrene caps are a faster cap and will help tighten the low end and can be a rather bright cap and can at times be a bit harsh sounding (especially in and overdrive type amp)
Paper in oil type caps tend to have a very tight low end quality to them and have a much darker and sweeter type sound..These tend to do OK in a very clean type amp however do color the sound as well as the distortion characteristics in an over driven style amp..
Like anything else caps are a very subjective component, much like a speaker has, so you just have to be willing to experiment around and see how that cap works with that amp and your style of playing.. Also the same type cap but a different voltage rating can also effect sound and feel..

Good Luck!!

Tony

[martin manning]

Bell's Two Hearted ;^)

[printer2]

What is a sound stage?



So how much difference is there between caps in the midrange or high end. A dB, two? Would we not be able to measure the change in voltage with a signal generator and a scope?

[Teleguy61]

Smuttynose or Ipswich.

[rooster]

+1 what talbany said. I will also add, as an example, that I recently ran into a Billy Zoom modified BF Bassman that winded the signal path through 3 gain stages that finally ended with a .01 polystyrene coupling cap. The amp had an edge to it that really cut through a mix, let me say that about it.

[cpollack]

+1 to Goose Island and Bell's. I knew this forum had good taste in more than just tone.