71$/hour

[bnwitt]

Well first of all, my name is not Bob. Secondly, I've given it plenty of time and I'm old enough to have seen more than my share of negative and positive financial cycles so I’m not lined up behind you with my “The end is near!” sign. I can tell you that each negative financial cycle has been preceded by knuckleheads meddling with (regulating) capitalism like Mr. Bush is doing right this very instant.

This particular debacle was preceded by the meddling of Barney Franks Chris Dodd and others who were doling out money to continuants who couldn’t pay it back. That kind of handout my friend is what you continually espouse and it is doomed to fail every time. There is not enough product on this planet to support massive give a ways. When you take from the worker too much, he becomes the dependant as was shown with the Soviet Union’s attempt at communism. Let’s all lie down and wait for the state to support us, no sense in working hard, they're just gonna take it. There currently is no viable utopian society possible no matter how hard anyone wishes for it.

If you leave capitalism alone it thrives because there is a carrot for every mule willing to pull the plow. The hard working folks do fine in a capitalistic society. The lazy slobs, unfortunately, get what they've earned as well. It's the age old ant and the grasshopper story. Unfortunately when enough grasshoppers get together, they can put a rep in the whitehouse.

I'm also old enough to have seen the lack of success from socialism, communism and many other forms of government so I know what works best. You say you are lucid. I say you are myopic. Whether your narrow focus is due to a lack of historical knowledge or just driven by some personal negative wishful thinking is unknown to me, but your assertions are none the less ludicrous and not worthy of further review. Yet, you keep repeating them like some broken record over and over again. For what reason I cannot imagine. But god is it borish.

[Tubetwang]

Barry...with all due respect...you are wrong...

The crisis is due in parts to bankers selling morgages to folks that could not afford them homes...

Regulated capitalism will ask for someone to have 25% of the total value of the home they want to purchase and the bank will finance the rest. Around 4.5% in my neck of the woods.

Un-regulated capitalism has no law and order.

This crisis was written all over but you did not want to see it...

But you are resilient and an easy going guy...

You'll manage...

[bnwitt]

Twang, you are misinformed. You obviously have not done your research buddy. Have you even bothered to read any of the U.S. House of Representitives bills from the 90's in detail or do you get all of your information from liberal canadian news agencies? I'm not going to waste time arguing with a lemming.

[CaseyJones]

Casey, Je suis un Texan, et Je parle Francais aussi. Peut etre, vous ne comprend pas- Les personne ici dans le Republique de Texas sont plus intelligent....

"Ich bin ein Berliner!!!!"

[bnwitt]

Twang, do your damned home work and really find out what is going on. You've got a hummingbird knowledge and an alligator mouth on this rampant capitalism subject. Go to this link:

http://thomas.loc.gov/home/multicongres ... gress.html

and search the term "mortgage" for all congresses back to the 101st. Then start reading the content of the bills. Otherwise shutup cause you haven't got a clue what you are talking about. Lack of regulation had nothing to do with this crisis. Meddling with the natural flow of capitalism by congress did this. Banks won't lend money if they think they are going to loose it unless the are legistlated to do so. Wise up already. I'm not going to discuss this with you again until you gain some actual knowledge from research.

[Tubetwang]

Ok...i'll start reading and maybe get back... if i find anything to ad up...

[Ron Worley]

Casey, Je suis un Texan, et Je parle Francais aussi. Peut etre, vous ne comprend pas- Les personne ici dans le Republique de Texas sont plus intelligent....

"Ich bin ein Berliner!!!!"

Ich war eine Deutcher auch, Ich habe aus Deutchland Gewhont for drei und halb jares.... Aber Ich bin eine Texan immer!

Herr Worley

[bnwitt]

Three and a half years? Wow. I bet you miss the bier und fraulein.

[CaseyJones]

Casey, Je suis un Texan, et Je parle Francais aussi. Peut etre, vous ne comprend pas- Les personne ici dans le Republique de Texas sont plus intelligent....

"Ich bin ein Berliner!!!!"

Ich war eine Deutcher auch, Ich habe aus Deutchland Gewhont for drei und halb jares.... Aber Ich bin eine Texan immer!

Herr Worley

Deutschland, Deutschland über aller halben Kartoffel, alle die ist.

[M Fowler]

Wie wäre es mit euch Bail-out der Wirtschaft

Potates grow in Idaho too.

Mark

[CaseyJones]

Wie wäre es mit euch Bail-out der Wirtschaft

Potates grow in Idaho too.

Mark

Now there's a thought. A potato based economy. Not that farfetched... 150 years ago Ireland had a potato based economy.

20 years ago Russia had a cabbage based economy as far as the average Russian was concerned...

[Tubetwang]

Potato????

This is my area of expertize...

http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=CpAJOPzKK-M

[Ron Worley]

Mark-

Sorry if I hijacked the thread with my linguistic BS..... Yes, we were discussing the "Wirtshaft"....... And your Deutch is better than mine.... I can't read or write it very well..... but after a couple Biers..... I can hang with the boys in the Gausthaus!!

[j-po]

...Lack of regulation had nothing to do with this crisis. Meddling with the natural flow of capitalism by congress did this. Banks won't lend money if they think they are going to loose it unless the are legistlated to do so...

From what I heard banks were trying to make a quick profit by selling expensive loans to people who they knew could not afford them. The mistake was thinking the value of the house would secure their investment. In their greed they failed to take into account what would happen when too many loans like this were out.

I think regulating a max loan/salary ratio and requiring sufficient initial investment from the home owner himself would have prevented this.

Talk about the automobile industry. America likes free trade as long as America is the one benefiting. As soon as the free market turns in favor of someone else, the taxpayers money or import duties come to the rescue. Not having to compete internationally makes companies lazy and eventually unsuccessful.

Too bad America is going down financially like this while at the same time making enemies abroad. Ad to this the fact that China and Russia with no free speech or democracy are doing better all the time. I'm afraid this makes the world a more insecure place. Oh well, as long as I can play my guitar everything is fine.

[bnwitt]

From what I heard banks were trying to make a quick profit ... In their greed they failed to take into account what would happen when too many loans like this were out..

And you see that is the problem. "From what I heard....". Everyone needs to ask themselves this question. If you walked into a bank and said “I make $8.50 and hour, have no other income and my bills add up to almost everything I make after taxes monthly. But, I want a loan to buy this house I really can't afford." How hard do you think the loan officer would laugh at you? Do you think you would get a loan? How does greed enter into this equation when you know the borrower is going to default?

Now J-po I posted a link in this thread to the congressional website which has all of the bills generated by both the house and senate. I even showed a page capture with instructions on how to get the information on the bills that would show everyone what congress did to force this lending on the banks in their legislation. Did you go to the site and do some research before you made this "From what I heard..." post? You did not. Just like millions of Americans who do not take the time to find out what is really going on, you just regurgitated what you heard. This is why the average American citizen has absolutely no clue what is really going on. No offense intended J-po and nothing personal as even I find it really hard to wade through these exceeding long bills with so much legalise dribble, but we have to do it to keep the watch on.

Congress is the villain in this debacle just like they are the villain in almost every national issue. The number of bills proposed and enacted by congress annually is staggering. Do we really need all of these new laws? The answer is no. But, every new bill usually has some wonderful title and communicated purpose with page after page of earmarks and other riders tacked on for the benefit of some congressman or senator’s financial gain. They make the bills as difficult to read and decipher as possible in order to screen the hidden riders but really just count on the laziness of Americans to get away with it. I spoon fed everyone who has read this thread with the tool to discovery and I wonder how many have used that tool. This is why the ‘how Obama got elected” video scares me.