Speaker choice

[Funkalicousgroove]

Regarding the EVM-12L:

It is my understanding (from a VERY reliable source) that the EVM-12L was actually Howard's third choice, The first being the Altec 417 8H (Ceramic not Alnico) then the Electrovoice EVM-12s, then the EVM-12L. the 12S has a resonant frequency of 70Hz vs the 55Hz of the 12L.

The SRO was another favorite, and I understand that the Weber Alnico Michigan does a good job with this flavor.

I got the G12-65's, and I like them alot, very "Robbenesque"

Last I heard he had a Tonker in the 1x12 Green combo.........

[dogears]

I heard from directly from Eminence that Robben's Tonker was not a production unit. I don't know that he ever played what you or I would get. I heard it was some kind of prototype and that he is not sampling them anymore either. In any event, Tonker's suck IMO. I have had 4 of them and they really hurt my ears....

Regarding the EVM-12L:

It is my understanding (from a VERY reliable source) that the EVM-12L was actually Howard's third choice, The first being the Altec 417 8H (Ceramic not Alnico) then the Electrovoice EVM-12s, then the EVM-12L. the 12S has a resonant frequency of 70Hz vs the 55Hz of the 12L.

The SRO was another favorite, and I understand that the Weber Alnico Michigan does a good job with this flavor.

I got the G12-65's, and I like them alot, very "Robbenesque"

Last I heard he had a Tonker in the 1x12 Green combo.........

[jaysg]

In any event, Tonker's suck IMO. I have had 4 of them and they really hurt my ears....

Scott, how are you going to sell them off with a sales pitch like that?

[dogears]

I gave two away to Carl Burnett (great NYC guitarist). He loaded them into a Fender open back cab and seemed to like them with his strat. I think they replaced Vintage 30s, so that could explain the improvement.

I still have the other set.

I never sell anything. I am a horder.

In any event, Tonker's suck IMO. I have had 4 of them and they really hurt my ears....

Scott, how are you going to sell them off with a sales pitch like that?

[stelligan]

I have a G1265, EV12L, and Emi RWB here. I may do an A/B/C test soon in a 1X12 open back cab and post on this thread. Clean and OD short clips dry with SM57. The G1265 is new with not many hours on it. Test amp will be a 50 watt non-HRM or 6L6 D'Lite.

I could also try a Cannabis Rex and one of those $20 CL80 clones if anyone is interested. Would y'all prefer it to be blindfold?? Lemme know.

[skyboltone]

I have a G1265, EV12L, and Emi RWB here. I may do an A/B/C test soon in a 1X12 open back cab and post on this thread. Clean and OD short clips dry with SM57. The G1265 is new with not many hours on it. Test amp will be a 50 watt non-HRM or 6L6 D'Lite.

I could also try a Cannabis Rex and one of those $20 CL80 clones if anyone is interested. Would y'all prefer it to be blindfold?? Lemme know.

Great idea mister. Blind to us for (say) 1 week, guessing encouraged, then the great day of revelation. I've seen these tests before on another forum. The great American acoustic strings shootout had several former Elixir string bashers picking them over everything else.
Another one with bone vs plastic vs brass saddle pins was much easier. The brass were suuuuuuuper bright and the distinction between bone and plastic much more subtle. Still, lots of folks chose the plastic pins.

Do it. And yes, please include Cannabis Rex. I move for a call for contributions for actual cash outlay. If you have to buy a speaker that you don't want we ought to help out.

DanH

[dogears]

Clips are virtually meaningless. I have done hundreds of clips. Even the RWB sounds great in clips. You can optimize recording techniques and mixing to compensate for anything. To A/B speakers, maintaining the same micing is wrong. You should make the clips as good as possible using each and then see which comes out "best". Even then, the room tone of the G1265 versus RWB is stunning. Not a single person out of dozens I have helped has in any way considered the RWB a viable option. I have countless PMs and email testimonials as proof. The RWB is muddy and dark. If, in fact, someone prefers the RWB, it is because the amp build has harsh sibelence that is not being heard with the RWB. Can you say bandaid? In a good build, there is no competition....

[stelligan]

I tend to side with dogears - . Plus it lets me off the hook for the process! I was kicking myself right after I posted. Microphones do not trump a good set of ears - especially an SM57 microphone. I have always figured that if I yanked a speaker out of a cabinet, there had to be a good reason. It's really a hassle. I pulled out the RWB because it was too mid heavy and not bright enough, pulled out the EV12L 'cause it was too "heavy" heavy and seemed a hair harsh for lack of a better word -I've owned it since the late 70's -may be worn out. I'm so far liking the G1265 much more than the others. From what I've noticed, dogears isn't fond of being proven correct . My amps are not HRM and the OD is a little harsher from what I have read. I am soon to complete an HRM of sorts and will be back to the speaker thang again but, unlike Scott I am not a horder. So, I may post a slew of cheap cones on the for sale page soon.

[dogears]

HA! All I know is I have spent a thousand hours or more and thousands of $ testing all of this stuff. If my observation is subtle, then I say so and don't "push" my opinion. On the other hand, when something is crystal clear, ie Telefunken 12AX7 sounds better than Sovtek 12AX7WC or RWB speakers have no high end, then I get pushy. There is no right or wrong, but somethings are plain obvious. If they are not, then there is something wrong woth something else in the signal chain.

I tend to side with dogears - . Plus it lets me off the hook for the process! I was kicking myself right after I posted. Microphones do not trump a good set of ears - especially an SM57 microphone. I have always figured that if I yanked a speaker out of a cabinet, there had to be a good reason. It's really a hassle. I pulled out the RWB because it was too mid heavy and not bright enough, pulled out the EV12L 'cause it was too "heavy" heavy and seemed a hair harsh for lack of a better word -I've owned it since the late 70's -may be worn out. I'm so far liking the G1265 much more than the others. From what I've noticed, dogears isn't fond of being proven correct . My amps are not HRM and the OD is a little harsher from what I have read. I am soon to complete an HRM of sorts and will be back to the speaker thang again but, unlike Scott I am not a horder. So, I may post a slew of cheap cones on the for sale page soon.

[kleinm]

Not a single person out of dozens I have helped has in any way considered the RWB a viable option. I have countless PMs and email testimonials as proof.

I'm one of them. dogears graciously recommended the G12-65 to me. I had two RWBs in an oval-back 2x12. The RWBs were horribly inarticulate and muddy. Fat, but muddy.

The G12-65s are some of the best speakers I've played in any context or with any amp. I love them. Even though they're about $100 more than the RWB, I think they're definitely worth the money even if its an issue. You'll spend more than that chasing your tail trying to get better cleans and more articulate drive out of your amp, IMHO.

Props to the Heritage G12-65s.

[greiswig]

One thing that I'm having a hard time finding (if it's there) is something that outlines what cabinets are being used...at least whether they're closed back, ported, open back, etc. IME, some speakers that sound lousy in open back cabinets work well in closed back setups, and vice versa.

Also, what power is being run into them? I have a Celestion Blue that I was using with a 30-watt Bad Cat and a MASS attenuator, and I like it at low volume...but at stage volume, probably somewhere around 12-15 watts, it stops giving...I can't boost volume on leads. However, the Weber AlNiCo Blue Dog I have that's rated at 18W seems to keep up fine.

[Funkalicousgroove]

well dog,

perhaps through a 1x12 a tonker sounds like crap, but in an open 2x12 in combination with a Swamp Thang it sounds really fantastic, you heard this combination at the NAMM show with me, it sounds good. Individually both speakers are lacking in certain departments, but together they are great.

BTW, if anyone wants G12 65's I can get them for $147 ea plus s&h.

[heisthl]

What's the best 10" for these amps? None? I'm using an eminence legend right now and it sounds better than a rajin cajin or a clestion special design 60. The JBL K110 I tried was not a fair test because the speaker has age problems. If anyone has a favorite please qualify if your using it single or in a pair setup.
As far as 12's go my favorite open back test cabinet has a G series JBL 12 It definitely blows the EV away and sounds better than the 16ohm G65-12 I have that came in a early 90's Carvin.

[Funkalicousgroove]

I had a guy stop by my shop a while back with one of those JTM60 4x10 cabs and it friggin ROCKED!! not real sure what was in it but it was stock.

[JamesO]

Ok, well, I just ordered a G12-65. Happy, scott?

I can audition the Two-Rock and Celestion and choose the one I like most. I got a great price from a friend, so I won't lose much if I sell the Celestion.

How many hours would you say they take to break in?