New ReleaSSSes

[glasman]

This is getting pretty funny if you ask me.

Now we have MULTIPLE builders using the same name for their products (all of which are the same as Alexander used).

And you know the best part, they are probably all using the same crappy hand drawn 3 page schematic of SSS#002 from Japan that is LOADED with mistakes and a few really bizarre design mistakes (or cloning/transcription issues).

I will be building a 200W amp in the near future, I think I will call it the SSS too . Except mine will be the SIXTH STREET SH$TSTORM....

[sonicmojo]

In my pic, the green/purple wires come up from the inductor to the blob near that front trimpot. The blue/red wires lead from there to the filters.

[LeftyStrat]

And you know the best part, they are probably all using the same crappy hand drawn 3 page schematic of SSS#002 from Japan that is LOADED with mistakes and a few really bizarre design mistakes (or cloning/transcription issues).

Anyone know where I can get a copy of that? I don't care if it has mistakes. So did the first TW and Dumble schematics, but people on this board all contributed and gave freely to the community.

The only parts really missing are:
- Reverb circuit
- Step filters and inductor
- Maybe some of the LNFB.

The funny part for me is that there are two very different SSS topologies. The standard topology and SRV's KTC/SSS, which is more of a SSS preamp with a Dumbleland power amp.

Long ago it was hinted to me (and maybe disinformation), that some had a concertina phase splitter, and the post PI drivers were not cathode followers.

Just kind of bugs me that when this here Animal Farm first started (and I was member #9) it was "All animals are equal" and now somehow it has become "But some animals are more equal than others."

[bcook]

Long ago it was hinted to me (and maybe disinformation), that some had a concertina phase splitter, and the post PI drivers were not cathode followers.

Look up a Williamson amp. It sounds quite good actually.

[LeftyStrat]

Look up a Williamson amp. It sounds quite good actually.

Quite familiar with this. I realize now the info I was given was for the Winterland, not the SSS.

[glasman]

The SSS bits I have seen use a standard long tail PI feeding a driver stage to feed the grids.

The thing you need is LARGE signal swing and a low impedance drive for the grids. I doubt the cathodyne would have enough signal swing to drive 6550's or KT88s to full output. Remember the driver only provides the impedance and current requirement, not the signal swing.

My target swing for my hi power amp (not a copy, clone or other facsimilie of the SSS) is about 100V p/p.

Gary

[jelle]

Gary, the Ceriatone amp does remind me of the two rock Sterling in terms of layout, features and tube count.

[glasman]

Gary, the Ceriatone amp does remind me of the two rock Sterling in terms of layout, features and tube count.

Yeah, but no driver, according to Bill, the Sterling had the driver stage. He said is was a copy of Henrys. But Henrys are also low power ones. Who knows.

I know how I am going to buid my amp, but I am not going for a SSS, I am building a hi power Glaswerks. My own virgin design. My use (or at least test) the loop ideas from the SSS. But I want multiple clean front ends, internal loop, spring or digi reverb as implemented in the SOD II amps and reverb.

The power transformer has 2 HV taps, 2 Filament taps, bias winding, low voltage tap. The OT is HUGE, about 3/4" more iron than the SOD II's 100W OT, which is 2x the size of a twin.

Gary

[David Root]

The pic I've seen of the 100W SSS has the CF driver, also direct coupled IIRC, and the standard 12AX7 820/24K PI with about 110K or so plates, which will easily give you +/- 50V (100V p-p) with about 25-30 gain at the right B+, ie from a BF Twin PT in this case.

You can use some different driver tubes from 12AX7 thru 12AT7, 6FQ7/6CG7, 12BH7, or even a 12BZ7. CF application is a bit of a leveler in that respect because it's always < unity gain and guaranteed low output impedance, but current draw capability is another matter I think. Have to play with the raw bias too.

In the 150W w/6550s I would go for the 12BH7 myself. I believe HAD used relatively high plate voltages on his 12BH7 drivers, compared with what I've seen in the '50s audio designs, but I could be wrong on that, it's easy enough to hide a dropping resistor. Not sure if he always used direct coupled CFs in these. I've seen '50s designs with direct coupled PI and cap coupled CF drivers, which seems bass ackwards to me.

[Max]

Gary, the Ceriatone amp does remind me of the two rock Sterling in terms of layout, features and tube count.

Yeah, but no driver, according to Bill, the Sterling had the driver stage. He said is was a copy of Henrys. But Henrys are also low power ones. Who knows.

AFAIK Henry Kaiser owns two 100W SSSs - one without a separate driver tube - one with such a separate driver tube.

In the 150W w/6550s I would go for the 12BH7 myself.

You'll find the 12AU7 phase inverter / 12BH7 driver configuration in 100W Dumble amps, too. The Odyssey is an example for such a Dumble 100W power amp with such a kind of configuration. And AFAIK Odyssey power amps have been used by some guitar players, too (Eric Johnson, Jay Graydon, Rob Madden e. g.).

Cheers,

Max

[LeftyStrat]

I guess the only way TAG members will ever get a schematic of the SSS is to buy a clone and blueprint it.

[David Root]

Thank you Max, I didn't know that about the 12AU7 PI in the Odyssey. I believe he also used that PI/driver combination in the bass amps, Dumblelands.

[Max]

Thank you Max, I didn't know that about the 12AU7 PI in the Odyssey. I believe he also used that PI/driver combination in the bass amps, Dumblelands.

AFAIK you'll find the "phase inverter" / "driver" (AFAIK this is how Alexander Dumble calls these two stages) combination in these versions:
12AX7/7025 phase inverter and 12AX7/7025 driver (some 150W SSSs and some 100W SSSs, ODS 150W, Odyssey e.g.)
12AU7 phase inverter and one 12BH7 (Winterland and Dumbleland 150W, some SSSs 150W e.g.) or two 12BH7 (Dumbleland 300SL e.g.) driver/s

AFAIK you'll find the 12AU7 phase inverter and the 12BH7 driver combination in both versions of the Dumbleland 150W, the version for bass and the version for guitar.

Cheers,

Max

[ER]

Just an idea, would it be worth the effort to add the step filters to a reverb/dumblelator unit? I know it won't turn an ODS into an SSS but could be cool to broaden the tonal spectrum.

I'm thinking parallel reverb, but not sure if step filters should go before or after the dumbleator loop, I would think before to approximate stage location in an SSS and be able to shape the tone hitting a delay or other effect in the loop.

Thoughts?

[talbany]

Thank you Max, I didn't know that about the 12AU7 PI in the Odyssey. I believe he also used that PI/driver combination in the bass amps, Dumblelands.

AFAIK you'll find the "phase inverter" / "driver" (AFAIK this is how Alexander Dumble calls these two stages) combination in these versions:
12AX7/7025 phase inverter and 12AX7/7025 driver (some 150W SSSs and some 100W SSSs, ODS 150W, Odyssey e.g.)
12AU7 phase inverter and one 12BH7 (Winterland and Dumbleland 150W, some SSSs 150W e.g.) or two 12BH7 (Dumbleland 300SL e.g.) driver/s

AFAIK you'll find the 12AU7 phase inverter and the 12BH7 driver combination in both versions of the Dumbleland 150W, the version for bass and the version for guitar.

Cheers,

Max

Max
If you were to order an SSS from Had tomorrow would you request that your variant be equipped with the Driver tube in a 100w 6l6 version..
If so what is it about this perticular circuit that adds or subtracts to your enjoyment of playing an SSS with this feature .. Also if you have a favorite tube compliment you prefer For this mod (12au/bh7 etc etc) what would that be and again briefly why?..

Thanks in advance!!

Tony