102 as Lowplate Classic

[aflynt]

Thanks Structo!

You can send me that 335, Jack!

I think I'm losing it trying to figure out what's going on with the rock/deep/pab switch interactions on this thing. The way it's wired, with the PAB and Deep engaged, sonically the mid pot becomes a low mid pot (IE: still does stuff when turned), especially when in Rock mode. I don't know what the heck is going on in PAB/Deep/Jazz mode though. When the deep is off it actually does seem like a normal stack lift.

I'm wondering if the wiring of the deep switch with the 270k tied to the common lug on the Rock/Jazz was really meant to go with the 3 way Rock/Jazz with the middle off (PAB?) position. Would the middle off PAB then be different than the footswitch PAB? I don't have the 3 way Rock/Jazz switch, btw. When I engage the PAB from the footswitch, the Rock/Jazz switch has a big effect on the sound still. Which of those modes do you get with the center off PAB, the Rock/PAB sound or the Jazz/PAB sound?

I think I'd need to draw 5 different schematics to really grock it.
-Aaron

[jam-mill]

Thanks Structo!

You can send me that 335, Jack!

[...]

-Aaron

Aaron,

You can have the guitar; the 'shipping' cost is $3750.00.

-jack

[Structo]

On the Rock / Jazz switch if you have a three position switch, switch up is Rock, middle is PAB and Jazz is down.

I believe it is an option since there is no PAB switch on the front panel.

[aflynt]

On the Rock / Jazz switch if you have a three position switch, switch up is Rock, middle is PAB and Jazz is down.

I believe it is an option since there is no PAB switch on the front panel.

Right but the foot switched PAB sounds different depending on if you're in Rock or Jazz mode. So would the middle position sound like Rock PAB or Jazz PAB? I'm guessing Rock right, or would it have a different 3rd sound?

-Aaron

[Structo]

Ahh I get ya.

I guess I don't mess too much with the switches on the front panel.

I don't think I honestly ever played it much in the Jazz setting if ever, so
I hadn't tried that combination.

I have Mid Boost, OD and PAB on the pedal.

[Charlie Wilson]

My guess would be no difference. PAB lifts tone stack. I would flip on the back panel PAB switch and then flip from Rock to Jazz and see what it does. Ah I should read better, you already did that. I started to stare at the schematic and now I have a headache.
CW

[aflynt]

Okay, here's what's going on sonically:

PAB: on, Deep: off, Rock: on - Normal PAB sound, tone controls inactive.
PAB: on, Deep: off, Rock: off - Normal PAB sound, tone controls inactive.
PAB: on, Deep: on, Rock: on - Near normal PAB sound with mid on 10, pulling down mid notches out low-mid/high-bass.
PAB: on, Deep: on, Rock:off - Thinner PAB sound, tone controls inactive.

Seems like what's confusing me is that the deep filter is active when in PAB mode. I suppose that makes sense, functionally, since the mid switch was active in PAB mode with the Skyliner stack (tone controls inactive in all positions in Skyliner, though).

-Aaron

[Aaron]

I thought the front switch PAB is different because it's not limited by the 22M resistors. So has more of a jump in volume.

Aaron

[bcook]

I didn't like how the deep switch affected the PAB tone, so I rewired mine to connect the mid cap to the bass pot tail resistor al la Fender.

[aflynt]

Okay. I found that I could actually balance the Rock/Jazz switch in the middle position to get the other PAB sound. My amended list of PAB results:

FS PAB = Footswitch Preamp Boost
RJ PAB = Rock Jazz "middle" mode Preamp Boost

FS PAB: on, Deep: off, Rock: on - Normal PAB sound, tone controls inactive.
FS PAB: on, Deep: off, Rock: off - Normal PAB sound, tone controls inactive.
FS PAB: on, Deep: on, Rock: on - Deeper PAB sound with mid on 10, pulling down mid notches out low-mid/high-bass.
FS PAB: on, Deep: on, Rock:off - Thinner PAB sound, tone controls inactive.
RJ PAB: on, Deep: off - Normal PAB sound, tone controls inactive.
RJ PAB: on, Deep: on - Less loud, more balanced PAB sound, tone controls inactive.

In summary, when in the Rock/Jazz switch "middle" PAB mode I've found that:
1. The tone controls have no effect no matter what the other switches are set at.
2. The footswitch PAB doesn't change the sound at all when turned on or off.
3. With the Deep switch off the sound is pretty much identical to the "Normal" Rock mode / Deep off footswitch PAB sound.
4. With the Deep on, the sound is more balanced low to high than the "Normal" PAB sound, quieter than the "Normal" PAB sound, and REALLY great for hard rock sounds.

I'd recommend a 3 position Rock Jazz switch with this circuit just to get that great extra "shred" sound. I'm starting to hear where Max was coming from when he commended that the Low Plate Classic with HF Taper was a very versatile setup. You can dial a very wide variety of great sounds in with this thing.

-Aaron

[aflynt]

I decided that I liked the middle position PAB with deep option much better than either of the two other PAB / deep sounds with the footswtich so I came up with what I think is a better wiring scheme. Basically it's a full stack lift (no 22Meg resistors) with the 270k deep resistor connected to the bass pot wiper instead of the rock /jazz switch. Now there are just 2 different PAB sounds, full stack lift when the deep is off and "shred mode" stack lift when the deep is on. What I'm calling the "shred mode" stack lift is actually less loud and gainy than the full lift, but very mid-focused and tight.

Layout:
https://tubeamparchive.com/download/file.php?id=39397

Schematic:
https://tubeamparchive.com/download/file.php?id=39396

-Aaron

[aflynt]

I was thinking about how I could dial this amp to "sound" Fendery, but not "feel" Fendery and decided to try ditching the LNFB on the D-Lator loop return. It's still Dumbly, but now it's less compressed and when you lean into the notes they scream instead of squish. Playing it is now kind of like an idealized cranked Super Reverb kind of experience, but at a wide range of volume levels.

I did a video that I hope somewhat conveys this responsiveness. I have the amp dialed as follows: Volume: 7, Bright: off, Deep: on, Rock: on, Treble: 5, Mid: 2, Bass: 2 1/2, OD Level: 4, OD Ratio: 3, Master: 7 1/2, Presence: 7, D-Lator Send: 4, D-Lator Return (master): 2.

http://youtu.be/SVt4J-i5jt8

-Aaron

[bluesfendermanblues]

I was thinking about how I could dial this amp to "sound" Fendery, but not "feel" Fendery and decided to try ditching the LNFB on the D-Lator loop return. It's still Dumbly, but now it's less compressed and when you lean into the notes they scream instead of squish. Playing it is now kind of like an idealized cranked Super Reverb kind of experience, but at a wide range of volume levels.

I did a video that I hope somewhat conveys this responsiveness. I have the amp dialed as follows: Volume: 7, Bright: off, Deep: on, Rock: on, Treble: 5, Mid: 2, Bass: 2 1/2, OD Level: 4, OD Ratio: 3, Master: 7 1/2, Presence: 7, D-Lator Send: 4, D-Lator Return (master): 2.

http://youtu.be/SVt4J-i5jt8

-Aaron

Sounds really good and very fendery (like The best of the fenderguru.com videos)

I'll give it a try in my amps.

[dcribbs1412]

Clips sound great Aaron
does your dlator use a choke?
Thanks for info

D

[dcribbs1412]

sorry double