Layout 5th Generation 183

[talbany]

But I can play better than you, and have a great ear. Sorry you cant stand me. Hey, I am just being honest, and I will share what I can, besides the pics of the innards of the best sounding Dumbnle I have ever heard. Show them how its done Howie!

Tag
Come on man.. Don't start this shit on my thread..Please!!

Tony

[ampdork]

Tag I know your intentions are good but please do not stir these guys up into thinking I am hiding anything.

I can't stand misinformation and so I would never try to pull one over in such a petty way.

It could also be argued that it is those kinds of comment that has "you know who you are" poking around trying to get shots on one of my builds.



So Tag please stop teasing the forum. It's not nice.

I truly believe there is far more to building an amp then schematic, layout, parts, values and lead dress.

It is an art. I KNOW that once the technical aspects are handled the real work comes...How to get your heart, soul and intent into the sum...
This is the only secret I know of...
I can not even articulate what my own notion of this is...
Suffice to say that this "secret" is MUCH harder to cultivate in ones self then it is to procure any form of schemata or layout or pics.
That place is such a fine place to come to that I would never even think of making the path to it any harder for anyone else.

Namaste

[dreric]

Suffice to say that this "secret" is MUCH harder to cultivate in ones self then it is to procure any form of schemata or layout or pics.
That place is such a fine place to come to that I would never even think of making the path to it any harder for anyone else.

Shad .........................Wow

Thanks for interjecting a little warmth, humility and truth

bowing right back at cha

Eric

[Max]

A 6th generation ODS with mid switch - 3 piece chassis,(wooden sides high plate no LNFB V1 Skyliner w/different script

Hi Tony,

first of all thanks for this great layout. Some comments:

IMO #183 isn't a 6th generation ODS amp but a 5th generation skyline / mid switch ODS amp. 6th generation ODS amps are IMO the skyline-HRM amps starting around series #200. And 6th generation ODS amps don't have three part chassis.

And even as many here like the tone of #183 a lot, one should be aware that (at least after all I know) #183 is perhaps not the most typical 5th generation ODS amp. Based on my own experiences with some 5th generation ODS amps I would say that concerning tone Peter Lerche's 5th generation ODS is perhaps a bit more typical, and most 5th generation amps I am familiar with (and have heard of) have 6L6 power tubes. Some have chokes, some not; some master volume bright caps, some not (if they have one, then mostly 68pF AFAIR); and AFAIR most I am familiar with have more usual snubber values in the 250 to 350 pF range.

IMO an important part of the tone of these 5th generation amps (and the skyline mods like #124) are the specs of the teflon coax he uses (and I have seen at least five different versions of teflon coax in these 5th generation amps). And AFAIR he at least sometimes used rather high capacitance cables in these amps (around 70pF/ft. and even more) and AFAIR some of them are teflon coax versions that are usually not used for the transfer of AF or HF signals but are/have been usually used as control cables.

Have fun with your builds!

Max

[67plexi]

Thank you tony for all your hard work you have made dreams a reality.

Steve.

[talbany]

Thanks Steve!!..

Hey Max.. My notes read 5. generation ODS like "Dumble #0144" or "Dumble #0147" had the different script but still "deep"-switch, most (some, all?) 3-piece chassis)

6. generation ODS like "Dumble #0176" or "Dumble #0184" (mid switch - most (all?) 3 piece chassis, some "Bluesmaster")

Do I need to revise my notes..

Thanks for clarify..

Tony

[UltraHookedOnPhonix]

Tony, the PT is marked, “Pacific 1052”. This is not right, as the company in possession of that EIA code (for the past 60 years) is TMI Transformer company:
www.tmitransformers.com

TMI manufactured the “TF” series of transformers for Magic Parts up until 2002/03. If you order the TF series from Magic Parts today, you’ll not get the same iron HAD used. More likely Marvel Electric Corp. (EIA code 989).

Also, why is there a date code on the PT dating it from the 16th week of 1997?

[Mr Dumble]

Tag I know your intentions are good but please do not stir these guys up into thinking I am hiding anything.

I can't stand misinformation and so I would never try to pull one over in such a petty way.

It could also be argued that it is those kinds of comment that has "you know who you are" poking around trying to get shots on one of my builds.



So Tag please stop teasing the forum. It's not nice.

I truly believe there is far more to building an amp then schematic, layout, parts, values and lead dress.

It is an art. I KNOW that once the technical aspects are handled the real work comes...How to get your heart, soul and intent into the sum...
This is the only secret I know of...
I can not even articulate what my own notion of this is...
Suffice to say that this "secret" is MUCH harder to cultivate in ones self then it is to procure any form of schemata or layout or pics.
That place is such a fine place to come to that I would never even think of making the path to it any harder for anyone else.

Namaste

Shad,
I have the pics I spoke of, and my neighbor is an electrical engineer who happens to owe me a few thousand dollars. I am going to give him the pics and the schematic, and see what he thinks. End of story. I will not post my findings here, but I will know whats going on. Thats all that really matters to me. I have no idea what you have or have not posted here, and it does not really matter, as our agreement was once I sold my amp, you could do as you please. You still have my amp, so you can sabotage it if you feel like it. The way I look at it is this way. The builders make a living selling amps. Not many on here do that as far as I can see. Why would guys who go through the hassel, actually spend 40-60K, or get lucky enough to see inside one of the most rare amps on earth just give away all the info? I sure as hell would not! Thats all I am saying! Everyone can do as they feel fit, and I am letting it be known how I feel. There are plenty of guys who can afford the real deal, so if they want to know whats inside, dont be so frigging cheap! Buy one, then share it with everyone like they expect others to do!

[Mr Dumble]

And even as many here like the tone of #183 a lot, one should be aware that (at least after all I know) #183 is perhaps not the most typical 5th generation ODS amp.

Agree. It is a VERY VERY special sounding Dumble. I know, I have played and heard enough of them. Best sounding overdrive I have ever heard.

[bluesfendermanblues]

Its probably a waste of time to argue with you, tag, but Im naive enough to give it a try......Gil Ayan posted The #124 pictures that started it All. I dont know Whether Or not hé actually owned that amp. However, hé posted the pics and I guess we All owe him a lot for that.

[talbany]

Tony, the PT is marked, “Pacific 1052”. This is not right, as the company in possession of that EIA code (for the past 60 years) is TMI Transformer company:
www.tmitransformers.com

TMI manufactured the “TF” series of transformers for Magic Parts up until 2002/03. If you order the TF series from Magic Parts today, you’ll not get the same iron HAD used. More likely Marvel Electric Corp. (EIA code 989).

Also, why is there a date code on the PT dating it from the 16th week of 1997?

UHOP
Thanks for stopping by..
Info came from Shad perhaps he can clarify
My notes don't show a date code so perhaps this can be a typo left from the Bluesmaster Layout I'll check and revise if needed

Tony

[Max]

Thanks Steve!!..

Hey Max.. My notes read 5. generation ODS like "Dumble #0144" or "Dumble #0147" had the different script but still "deep"-switch, most (some, all?) 3-piece chassis)

6. generation ODS like "Dumble #0176" or "Dumble #0184" (mid switch - most (all?) 3 piece chassis, some "Bluesmaster")

Do I need to revise my notes..

Thanks for clarify..

Tony

Hi Tony,

perhaps you confused the 5th generation skyline/mid switch ODS amps with the "classic > skyline transition generation ODS amps" in your notes?:
https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.ph ... 284#136284
https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.ph ... 990#135990
https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.ph ... 334#136334

All the best and thanks again,

Max

[Mr Dumble]

Its probably a waste of time to argue with you, tag, but Im naive enough to give it a try......Gil Ayan posted The #124 pictures that started it All. I dont know Whether Or not hé actually owned that amp. However, hé posted the pics and I guess we All owe him a lot for that.

That was Gils choice. No problems here, and I am not pissed at anyone. I am just saying its not something I would do, and you can tell, because I didnt do it.

[nickm57]

One question about the snubber values, they are rely low. Raw sounding amp? similar to no snubbers?

Sorry for my ignorance is this a pro players amp with commercially released recordings?

[CircuitButcher]

Muchas gracias Tony for the delightful results of all your efforts. Props to Omar for opening the garage & Allyn for continuing to host this site. Thanks to all posters - whether you or we realize it, you are striking chords and stirring thoughts.

Alexander is not only a circuit wizard, he understands where guitarists want to take their instruments (everywhere). HAD's designs are inspirational as is the attention to detail/component selection that make them work - whatever the market affords him, he is deserving. But I don't think he need be as protective of his art for reasons articulated by Shad.

briane's quote "it really is a journey, and you just can't farm out the battle wounds.' sums the landscape for me. There will always be the variables to deal with.

If one has access to wisdom of the ages he is still constrained by what he can assimilate. Sharing is the domain of the common good - I don't know what domain marketing belongs to but it doesn't appear to be directly aligned to substance and/or function.

Forum on - soapbox over & out...