dynaco?

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Fischerman
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Fischerman »

talbany wrote: FWIW.The mercury mags were/are wonderful iron in their own right but lacked the overtones... They also produce much of the sterile qualities associatted with using M6 where the origionals did not sound the least bit Hifi-ish (this could be due to the fact that this was seasoned iron) or perhaps the scatter winding technique Dynaco used ..They did generate a nice wide bandwidth..
Specifically referring to the Rocket here; back when I built my Rocket I did some research on AC30 iron. I remember that the Hayseed 30 builder had switched from the Mercury Mag Woden clone OT to a Heyboer (unsure of exact model) and had some complaints. The Heyboer had a wider frequency response and made the amps too boomy on bottom and too fizzy on top when overdriven. He ended up coming up with what he called the Alwood mod which IIRC was a mod package to the Cut control to limit the frequency response when using the Heyboer OT (since MM iron can be so expensive).

But that Heyboer OT he was using could have been (probably was) different than the HTS-8093. I guess the only reason I'm posting this is because it sort of agrees with what you posted about the overtones (but maybe not so much the hifi-ish part). I guess those overtones were not there in the old 60's Voxes. Maybe that is one of the things KF was trying to improve upon with the Rocket.

Thinking of doing another Rocket and choosing trannies hasn't gotten much easier! But it's good to have choices!
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RJ Guitars
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Re: dynaco?

Post by RJ Guitars »

Fischerman,

I always look forward to your build info, you always do good thorough work and I learn something every time.

I'll add a bit that a first rate builder named Bill Gill who has a shop up in Canada sent on comparing trannies in a Rocket build. He bought three from me:

1) Mercury Magnetics
2) Edcor rj-EM0721
3) Heyboer HTS-8093-1.

It turns out the Heyboer had a bad winding and we had to send it back and we never got another one to follow up with. (This has been a rare experience by the way).

Here is a segment of his notes back to me:

We had an interesting hour or so Friday evening comparing OPT's with the Rocket build and I thought I'd share them with you. I brought a friend and a friend of his over to play while I subbed different transformers in and out. They didn't know what I was doing but could hear different things. It took several rounds to get the different tones differentiated but I have to say that in the end, we were all in agreement with what we heard.

#1- Nice sounding, chimey with some grind - Edcor, 5.2k
#2- Grindy, no chime, definitely the least favourite. - Edcor, 6.6k
#3- Very chimey and jangley, much different than the first 2. - MM V30H, 4.2k
#4- A very nice mix of grind and chime, complex, interesting. - MM 045RS-L, 6.6k


In the end, I decided to leave the Edcor in the amplifier as it does sound Voxy enough and it's not worth the extensive trouble to change. I wish I would have had the Dynaclone to compare to. I know that MM does get slagged a lot on the boards for their prices but they do have nice product, possibly the best out there. The differences were not subtle here, especially after a few rounds of back and forth comparisons. The short-coming of the Radio Spares from MM is that there is no easy way to get different impedances but it really sounded spectacular. It would be my first choice for something a little different. FWIW.


I have been curious since then how the other Edcor OPT (rj-EM0720) I have would have sounded since it has a 4.3K tap? I think they sound great in a Rocket but this head to head comparison is really the best way to evaluate those sorta things. I think that Heyboer HTS-8093-1 and maybe even an original Dynaco are an essential data point as well.

Interesting stuff,

rj
Last edited by RJ Guitars on Fri Jun 10, 2011 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Fischerman
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Fischerman »

Interesting stuff to be sure RJ!

I still have the old e-mail exchange between me and Lyle Caldwell (of Psionic Audio), the guy who sold me the MM Woden clone (he had the best price I could find, still not cheap though). Our conversation was in the text of building a holy grail JMI AC30:
The RS OT they (MM) sell is a good option, but it's not going to give the "classic" AC30 sound - it's smoother with a slower transient response. A cool sound, but not what many JMI era AC30s sounded like.
That seems to agree with what Bill Gill had found.
Early brewers were primarily women, mostly because it was deemed a woman's job. Mesopotamian men, of some 3,800 years ago, were obviously complete assclowns and had yet to realize the pleasure of brewing beer.
MysteryFever
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Re: dynaco?

Post by MysteryFever »

@rdjones,

That amp looks a lot like my Sunn 200S that I've just restored. The A431-S OT on mine is indeed larger than the PT and I've been totally blown away by the sound of it. I have two, one with all original caps, tubes, trannies etc... and the one I restored with Triode-Store dynaco copies. The one with the new iron sounds BETTER than the original! I actually found the "unobtainium" cap can on Tubedepot.com for around $40, made by CE. They had a precise match as well as one with larger values. I went with the larger one for a clearer sound since I am in fact using it for bass as well as guitar. I am very impressed with the Triode-Store trannies, to say the least. Your rebuild looks great!
duriehill
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Re: dynaco?

Post by duriehill »

Does anyone know where to source rocket trannies in the uk?
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Richie
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Richie »

I'd have to look, but when i was building the 36watt marshall thing. The first amp or prototype used the Heyboer "stand up" version of the AC30 they had at the time. I'll add some to this in a min.

I then asked them if they had a more bumped up version that would be like 36 watts. HTS 7013-1 @ 4k

But i seem to remember liking the sound of the 30 watt OT a bit more.
I don't have the number for that on hand at the moment. But whatever the "Stand up" AC 30 version is, thats the PT and OT.

A couple of threads have come up on hammond transformers, and now the Dynaco. And i though sometimes things on here may be hard to find. A lot of information. But the link in the forum i am posting is a good read, by someone that built amps for Ken.
https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.ph ... sc&start=0
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Richie
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Richie »

"unobtainium" cap can
what might this be?
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Cantplay
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Cantplay »

The multi-part can cap with a high enough voltage rating.

John
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Richie
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Richie »

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Reeltarded
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Reeltarded »

I love those cans because they just plug in. If you had a reason you could change filtering in about 30 seconds.

Also they would make a good weapon in a pinch. ;)
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selloutrr
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Re: dynaco?

Post by selloutrr »

FWIW. You can't get the correct Rocket iron. The closest you can get is the Dynaco A470 OT. However it is not correct and not even that close. All of the rockets, and part of the reason their are so few of them. Was that each one was made using prototype iron based on Ken's hybrid winding chart combining several features of his favorite Output transformers.

With that said, for what you are building any of the clone iron will make a nice amp that you can voice with your tube compliment.
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Bob S
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Bob S »

For the record.
One of Chris's (Toneslut) Rocket Heyboers is labelled as follows :--
DYNACO 470 MOD
HTS 8093-1
9960902
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M Fowler
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Re: dynaco?

Post by M Fowler »

I built Rockets with Dynaclone A-470-S, Heyboer HTS-8093-1, and Edcor 4k3.

My favorite is the Edcor for bluesy darker tone with nice chime. 4K3 OT

If I want the Rocket amp to have more grit, british flavor I use the Dynaclone or Heyboer. Both 4K3 OT

Mark
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Colossal
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Re: dynaco?

Post by Colossal »

M Fowler wrote:My favorite is the Edcor for bluesy darker tone with nice chime. 4K3 OTsa
The blue end bells do lend a nice sound! :wink:
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